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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:47 am 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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Is there a good way to determine the number of grams of carbs and protein you want post-workout by your bodyweight?

I'm advising a friend who is heading into his first MMA fight. He's asked me what a good amount of protein and carbs is post-workout...but his weight is lower than mine. I realized I didn't have a good handle on per-bodyweight needs. What I've found seems to center on about 0.2 - 0.4 grams of protein per kg of bodyweight, and carbs:protein in a 2:1 ratio. If he's about 75kg he'd want 15-30g of protein and 30-60 grams of carbs. Is that about right?

Thanks,

Peter


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 8:12 am 
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That would sound good for just about anyone.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 8:29 am 
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In Memoriam: TimD
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It sounds right to me, but I don't really get that carried away with ratios anymore when it comes to post workout nutrition. I just "get something down my neck" and probably go lighter on the carbs than what would be recommended. Kenny has studied this in detail, is in the business, and could give you a more exacting ratio base on current science. Might want to PM him.
Tim


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 12:12 pm 
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I recently read Scrawny to Brawny by Berardi and he had significantly higher numbers. Basically he had 3 servings per workout, one before working out, one during the work out and 1 after. Each serving was .8 carb and .4 pro per Kg. That's 1000 calories for a 70Kg person. It seems excessive but that's what it said.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 12:48 pm 
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I think Berardi is a very smart doctor, but one thing I will not beleive is the excessive amounts of carbs and protein he beleives athletes should have.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 6:42 pm 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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Thanks guys. I'll pass this along to my friend. I appreciate the help.

Peter


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 9:50 am 
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hmm i used to eat a tripple whopper with cheese and bacon with a medium fry and a drink after a workout. I gained 25 lbs that month and spent a crap load of money. I lifted my butt off but ate it off too. im not sure whats what i just do what tim does and get something down my neck hey it works lol


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:45 pm 
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I weigh 73-74kg depending on water intake, time of day, scales used etc.

I take on about 35g of whey and a scoop of peanut butter (75ish grams). And it seems to be OK. Thats also about 10g of carbs I think.

I'm also trying NOT to gain weight.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:52 pm 
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Unless your going low carb daneil add a little something extra as carbs. 25g of protein is plenty as well.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 6:30 am 
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ironmaiden708 wrote:
Unless your going low carb daneil add a little something extra as carbs. 25g of protein is plenty as well.


Just out of interest, what is the reasoning behind this. I recently moved and I now eat 50g of oats with fruit juice and 2 hard boiled eggs, 40minute walk to the gym. warm up, workout cool down, shower, walk to work (5 mins) and drink a whey shake.

I don't find myself feeling particularly weak, so I don't add the sugar. If I do an interval weight training session then I sometimes do.

I am not really trying to go low low carb, just lower carb by cutting out all grains, starches, sugars etc (except that bowl before workout).


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:36 am 
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I'm sure others can explain it better but the time period after your workout is magic. Your body is starving for protein and glycogen. By taking high GI carbs and fast acting protein in a liquid, your insulin spikes and the nutrients go directly to your muscles. I think we discussed this some time ago and Ironman pointed out that for diabetics this is not a good thing but for everyone else, even those on low carb diets, this is the way to go. You can actually feel it working as your body will start to heat up again after you have stopped working out.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:48 am 
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Just to add a bit to Stu's post. The hi-GI does help in elevating insulin, but after a hard workout your body is pretty much in an insulin independent state anyway, and will absorb just about anything and send it to the muscles for glycogen, and the muscles need both P and C to manufacture glycogen. If your more like me, and not terribly into slapping on tons of muscle and eat a lowered starch diet anyway, yeah, loosen things up a bit with the GI thing, but no reason to go overboard if you're in my category. By overboard I'm talking sitting down and rolling through a pint of sugary ice cream or eating a big bowl of pasta. For me, the easy route if I don't feel like solid food is to mix some vanilla protein powder with 6 oz pineapple juice and some water or just take an MRP for P and C, and some fish oil .
Tim


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:02 am 
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I looked around for some articles that talk about this. Here is a quick summary from Berardi.
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/berardi23.htm

His recomendations look more normal here. The Scrawny to Brawny recommendations were for people having a really hard time gaining weight.

This article goes into more deatil on the theory:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/berardi59.htm

A little while ago chocolate milk was being talked about as a post workout drink. 500 ml contains almost the recommended ratio of protein and carbs. However, the GI is lower than whey and sugar or any of the commercial drinks, but it still works pretty good. Lately I've just been having a couple of peices of fruit followed by a can of tuna. Maybe I'm missing the boat here but like Tim, I'm OK with "good enough".


Stu


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 11:44 am 
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hey stu and tim if you dont mind me asking how big are you guys? are you guys bodybuilders or just healthy? Just curious.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:23 pm 
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I'm 58 YO, my main focus these days is just staying strong and fit. I did the PL/OL/BB/Athlete thing back in the younger days, and encourage it for you young pups, but at the moment I'm just trying to beat back the clock. I put on some good stuff back in the day, and for some reason it really hasn't gone away. My strength has dropped though, and I want to try and maintain what I've got, and/or at least stop the losses. At this point, I don't need any unecessary added bulk. While I'm certainly not huge, I am still stocky, always pretty much have been. 5'7 and on average 175-180.
Tim


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