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 Post subject: Routines, rest etc.
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:55 am 
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n00b
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I am just returning to training after a layoff, and I have a few questions. I understand that in general terms, we stress muscles during exercise which repair, rebuild etc. during resting days. Is there an optimum resting time? I see that if one does a full body workout every other day, muscles get around 48 hours of rest. If one does a 2 day split, ABXABX etc. the muscles being worked get an additional day, allowing of course for any synergists etc. being worked on thesupposed day off.
Another question I have involves rest within the work out session. I am currently doing a warm up set at half the workout weight (10 reps standard) before doing a single workout set to volitional failure. I find a considerable difference in what I can manage in my workout set depending on the rest time between warmup and workout. If I have too little, I can manage fewer workout reps, if I have too much rest I cool and the same thing results. Is there an optimum time, an average or whatever that I can employ. Thanks


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:07 am 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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Optimal rest time between workouts is highly variable. It will depend on a number of factors including overall volume and intensity, as well as personal factors like your age, metabolism, fitness level, diet and how much sleep you get. However, generally speaking 48 hrs should be considered minimal for a specific target muscle.

As for rest time between sets, I've never timed myself, chosing instead to go by feel. However, I have read that taking more than 5 minutes won't give you any additional benefit.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:55 am 
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Matt Z wrote:

As for rest time between sets, I've never timed myself, chosing instead to go by feel. However, I have read that taking more than 5 minutes won't give you any additional benefit.


Yeah, my research has lead me to the conclusions that resting up to 3 minutes between sets regains 85% of your max strength, while a full 90 minutes is required to regenerate your strength to 100%, or your full lifting capacity.

24 hours between body part workouts should be fine. If you're sore, eat protein, it'll help in the repairing of the muscle (as does sleep).


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:26 pm 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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In general I take longer between working sets than I do between warmup sets. Likewise, I rest for longer when performing heavy compound exercises like bench presses, squats and deadlifts than I do for exercises like curls and extensions.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:48 pm 
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Matt Z wrote:
In general I take longer between working sets than I do between warmup sets. Likewise, I rest for longer when performing heavy compound exercises like bench presses, squats and deadlifts than I do for exercises like curls and extensions.


Yeah, I warmup, take a minute before the second full weight set, and then 3 minutes before I start my third and final set.

Let me add that I use this rest routine when I am mass building; that is 90% of 1 rep max. 6-8 reps per set.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:16 pm 
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I highly doubt that 90% at 6-8 reps per set is truly 90%, unless you mean 90% of what you can do for 6-8 reps already. If it is 90% of your 1rep max then, that sounds a little fuzzy. In any case, if you are doing such an amazing feat, then it would definitely be strength building and not mass building.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:28 pm 
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Ryan A wrote:
I highly doubt that 90% at 6-8 reps per set is truly 90%, unless you mean 90% of what you can do for 6-8 reps already. If it is 90% of your 1rep max then, that sounds a little fuzzy. In any case, if you are doing such an amazing feat, then it would definitely be strength building and not mass building.


Nope. I can pull off 180 lbs. chest press (lever), 6-8 times (my single is 200 or thereabouts). My second set I add +5 - 10% to failure (usually about 4-5 reps after a 3 minute break). I tell you, I was making marvelous gains, up until now...

Granted, I used to do this before my injury, now I have cut back to about 80 - 85% of my 1RM with a higher rep, in order to lighten the load on my elbow, but still getting the benefits of strength training.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:06 pm 
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With compound exercises (mostly what I do), I decrease reps in each set and increase weight (usually by 10 lbs.) each set. I time my rests between sets (usually 4 sets) on my stopwatch at 2 to 3 minutes. I feel that is the minimum to move up 10 lbs. If I get more than 8 reps on my last set, I'll add more weight. I train this way about 6 months out of the year, usually in the winter months, to maintain my muscular weight. Many trainers at my gym superset all the time with high reps. You'ld never guess they got under a bar if you saw them in street clothes. That's why I started lifting in the first place -- to wear my effort in inches and pounds. Having some solid mass also makes me look younger at age 57.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:48 pm 
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I'm the same way. I go for approx 90% of my 1 rep max, and I reach failure between 6 and 8 reps. It's strange but small weight increases drop my reps very quick. another 5 or 10 pounds depending on what it is and I can only get 4. My 1 rep max on barbell bench is 230 (hey stop laughing), I barley got it up all the way. Then I can do 210 for 6. With 205 I am not not feeling like I've reached failure at 8, so I could probably do 9 if I tried.

I am sure my strength is low because I am on fat loss diet so maybe that has something to do with it. I'm not sure though. Maybe when I'm done with that and can actually do a real bulk for once, I'll find out.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:59 pm 
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The disparities aren't all that uncommon. It's partly on how you train rep range wise and the type of fibers you have, IIA or IIB fast twitch.
Dr Squat ot into a squatting competition with Tom Platz some years back, and Platz beat him badly for reps, think it was in the high 500 lb range, but when they tossed on the iron, Squat beat him badly, because he trained primaril in the low rep range.
Tim


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 12:34 am 
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That could be it. I do 99% body composition training. I have done very little training for strength. Just a couple times when I really needed to get the poundages up in order to keep progressing.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 11:00 am 
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I think it depends partly on the exercise. For example, with squats there's a fairly large difference between my 1RM and my 2RM, but with bench presses the difference isn't as great. I think this may be because squats have a much longer range of motion, which makes each rep take longer to complete.


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