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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:41 am 
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ozzy wrote:
Also read up on carb backloading after you guys just mentioned it, and I could easily adjust my diet to suit that, just by putting the rice from my first chicken meal into my second, and removing the wheat biscuit from breakfast, and replacing it somewhere else post workout. Is it worth giving that a try considering my current goals?

Carbs work best post workout, so yeah. It might give you slight improvement. Especially the biscuit part. None of that for breakfast. Also, you might want to keep some walking/activity before breakfast, and even move breakfast to one hour or more from waking. That will also promote fat loss, and promote growth hormone releases. Not a necessary thing tho, just one method.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:10 am 
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ozzy wrote:
Just looking a little closer at my diet that I posted above (which I drew up on myfitnesspal) and realised the information for broccoli is way off. There is no way there is 12g of carbs in a cup of broccoli.. there is another broccoli entry which seems to be more correct (about 7% carbs)


don't worry about counting the carbs or calories for foods like broccoli. They are referred to as incidentals. Just count the carbs from things like rice, potatoes and grains (although you should avoid all grains anyway).

You can eat an unlimited amount of fruit and veg. No one ever got fat from eating broccoli!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:29 am 
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ozzy wrote:
Jungledoc wrote:

If you are drinking that much because you have believe myths about more water being better for you, you could be harming yourself. Stop following some water goal, and drink only when you are thirsty, and only enough to keep you from being thirsty for a few hours. Your body has great regulatory mechanisms for thirst, so that it can keep a whole bunch of metabolic functions in balance. Don't mess it up by forcing more water than it needs or can handle.


I'll take your advice on board, I honestly do think I am drinking too much water... I'll try keep it to 3-4 litres a day.

No, you're missing the point. Don't measure your water. 3-4 L is still a lot. Drink by thirst.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:02 am 
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ozzy wrote:
Also read up on carb backloading after you guys just mentioned it, and I could easily adjust my diet to suit that, just by putting the rice from my first chicken meal into my second, and removing the wheat biscuit from breakfast, and replacing it somewhere else post workout. Is it worth giving that a try considering my current goals?


Any effect would be minor, and it does't work for everyone. I wouldn't worry about it right but you could experiment with it after a while. Once you're in maintenance mode it may be an idea.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:24 am 
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Jungledoc wrote:
ozzy wrote:
Jungledoc wrote:

If you are drinking that much because you have believe myths about more water being better for you, you could be harming yourself. Stop following some water goal, and drink only when you are thirsty, and only enough to keep you from being thirsty for a few hours. Your body has great regulatory mechanisms for thirst, so that it can keep a whole bunch of metabolic functions in balance. Don't mess it up by forcing more water than it needs or can handle.


I'll take your advice on board, I honestly do think I am drinking too much water... I'll try keep it to 3-4 litres a day.

No, you're missing the point. Don't measure your water. 3-4 L is still a lot. Drink by thirst.


3-4L is nothing here at the moment if I'm active and outdoors.. it was 40C/104F today. But yeah, I know what you mean, I'm not measuring it strictly, like you said I'm just going by thirst.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:11 am 
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Jungledoc wrote:
KenDowns wrote:
robertscott wrote:
Ken, no accessory work for your pressing muscles? Whyever not?


I don't like my workouts to go over 4 hours.

Yeah, but you have 2 sets of pulling accessories, and no pressing accessories. That would leave me hungry for more bench!


I'm starving for the bench, but shoulder rehab dictates otherwise. :sad:

My program right now is dominated by two facts:
1) Shoulder rehab has me going very slowly on pressing. I'm doing neutral db press, going up 5#/db/week, and I started over on empty bar for bench, doing 5x5, going up 20# per week. We'll see how that goes.
2) Accessories and coaching are producing lots of great results on dead and squat

So the upper body stuff right now lets me make up a historic pulling deficit, and will no doubt change in a few cycles. If and when my bench numbers come back up to where they were, if these accessories (provided largely by my trainer) keep me advancing then I won't put in specific pressing accessories. But that's getting ahead of myself for now.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:41 am 
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Yeah, I forgot about your shoulder stuff. But to suggest to someone else, maybe some bench accessory?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:45 am 
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Workout A: Back & Biceps
-Back (Lats) - Pulldown (Cable)
-Back (General) - DB Bent over row
-Back (Lats) - Standing Straight Arm Pulldown
-Back (General) - Wide Grip Incline Row (plate loaded)
-Biceps - BB Curl
-Brachialis - DB Concentration Curl
-Brachioradialis - DB Hammer Curl or BB Reverse Curl
-Wrist Flexors - BB Wrist Curl



Workout B: Chest & Triceps
-Chest (General) - Bench Press (Smith)
-Chest (Upper) - Incline Bench Press (Smith)
-Chest (General) - Standing Fly (Cable)
-Chest (General) - Wide Arm Seated Fly
-Triceps - Pushdown (Cable)
-Triceps - Bent-Over Triceps Extension (rope)
-Wrist Extensors - BB Reverse Curl



Workout C: Thighs
-Quadriceps - BB Squat
-Hamstrings - Lying Leg Curl
-Quadriceps - Leg Extension
-Hamstrings - Hyperextension
-Quadriceps - Incline Leg Press
-Hamstrings - Standing Leg Curl (Cable)
-Hip Adductors - Standing Hip Adduction
-Hip Adductors - Vertical Leg Raise



Workout D: Shoulders, Calves
-Deltoid (Front) - BB Military Press
-Calves (General) - Standing Calf Raise
-Deltoid (Side) - BB Upright Row
-Calves (General) - Incline Calf Press
-Deltoid (Side) - DB Lateral Raise
-Deltoid (Rear) - BB Rear Delt Raise
-Calves (Soleus) - Seated Calf Raise
-Trapezius (Upper) - Trap Bar Shrug
-Tibialis Anterior - Reverse Calf Raise


OK, just spent some time doing up this routine.... give me some opinions. Where can I insert Trap Bar Deadlifts into this?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:58 am 
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ozzy wrote:
Workout A: Back & Biceps
-Back (Lats) - Pulldown (Cable)
-Back (General) - DB Bent over row
-Back (Lats) - Standing Straight Arm Pulldown
-Back (General) - Wide Grip Incline Row (plate loaded)
-Biceps - BB Curl
-Brachialis - DB Concentration Curl
-Brachioradialis - DB Hammer Curl or BB Reverse Curl
-Wrist Flexors - BB Wrist Curl



Workout B: Chest & Triceps
-Chest (General) - Bench Press (Smith)
-Chest (Upper) - Incline Bench Press (Smith)
-Chest (General) - Standing Fly (Cable)
-Chest (General) - Wide Arm Seated Fly
-Triceps - Pushdown (Cable)
-Triceps - Bent-Over Triceps Extension (rope)
-Wrist Extensors - BB Reverse Curl



Workout C: Thighs
-Quadriceps - BB Squat
-Hamstrings - Lying Leg Curl
-Quadriceps - Leg Extension
-Hamstrings - Hyperextension
-Quadriceps - Incline Leg Press
-Hamstrings - Standing Leg Curl (Cable)
-Hip Adductors - Standing Hip Adduction
-Hip Adductors - Vertical Leg Raise



Workout D: Shoulders, Calves
-Deltoid (Front) - BB Military Press
-Calves (General) - Standing Calf Raise
-Deltoid (Side) - BB Upright Row
-Calves (General) - Incline Calf Press
-Deltoid (Side) - DB Lateral Raise
-Deltoid (Rear) - BB Rear Delt Raise
-Calves (Soleus) - Seated Calf Raise
-Trapezius (Upper) - Trap Bar Shrug
-Tibialis Anterior - Reverse Calf Raise


tut tut Ozzy, you ignored our advice about the full body or upper/lower split. Are you a steroid using advanced level bodybuilder? Because that's the routine you've provided.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:01 am 
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Jungledoc wrote:
Yeah, I forgot about your shoulder stuff. But to suggest to someone else, maybe some bench accessory?


From the looks of Ozzy's program, he doesn't need me to suggest that :grin:

But seriously, if Ozzy is not even logging yet, then I'm guessing this is beginner stage, and for the first program its probably good enough that everything works at first.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:10 am 
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ok, I've got some time to kill this afternoon...

Ozzy, your routine stinks. I could type out a big long explanation why, but I'm not going to. However, I am going to provide you with a much better workout.

Day A Horizontal Push/Pull

Bench
Row
Incline Dumbell Press
Face Pulls
biceps exercise

day B quad dominant

squat
RDL
abs
calves

day C Vertical Push/Pull

Shoulder Press
Chins
Lateral Raise
Straight Arm Lat Pulldowns
Triceps exercise

Day D Hip/Hamstring Dominant

Deadlift
Lunge
Calves
Abs

there you go. Only pick ONE exercise where I've left it up to you to choose. Don't do a zillion biceps exercises. More is not better. And do not let me catch you doing reverse curls or I will kill you.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:45 am 
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robertscott wrote:
day B quad dominant
squat
RDL

Just one beef with you robert. I wouldn't call this workout "quad dominant". Since there isn't really a quad dominant move in there. Squats a bit, but strongly influenced by hips and PC. Front Squats or Leg-elevated split squats would be more quad.
RDL? Nope.
But bitching aside, it's still a good lower body workout.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:48 pm 
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squats aren't quad dominant eh? El oh el


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 4:28 pm 
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Dub, please tell my quads that next time I over do it on squat day. I agree that RDL is more PC.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 4:55 pm 
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You started out saying that you'd been lurking here for a long time. While you were lurking did you actually read anything?

There are several hundred muscles that you don't list--let's get with it! And only 4 kinds of curls? If you want to set any records around here you'll need to add some more. And you never do more than 9 exercises a day? Wow, you could do more. And only 2 lifts in the Smith? Poor Mr. Smith will feel neglected.

Before I spend any more time on this thread, please assure me that you actually want advice. It sounds like you are going to do what you've already decided to do regardless of what any of us say.

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