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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:16 pm
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:12 pm
Posts: 2406
too many vairables
Even for one person it would take so many trials to get a good "formula"

I'd be glad to share the parameters and you can tweak it to fit your own results. For example, if you fatigue less duing longer sets, you wont need to drop the weight as much. Among other variables

When I have a 3x10 or 8x8 night, I just wanted to get a decent guess at th weight.
You can also use this to deload, or say you want 80% night, then hit the appropriate SetxRep number by 80%, and lift that weight.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:21 pm
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 5:44 pm
Posts: 6593
Location: Halifax, NS
The 1 predicted RM formula is for average people. Hard gainers are better with high reps since they have more slow twitch fibres and more endurance, therefore a lower 1RM than predicted. Fast gainers have more fast twitch fibre and have more power but less endurance so their 1RM will be greater than the predicted value.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:30 pm
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:12 pm
Posts: 2406
KenDowns wrote:
I don't know what your formula is though so I can't comment. My ignorance of your formula is also why I asked how you were calculating the effect of >1 sets.

yea Wendler is close to (37-R)/36 as well. The later I guess is this guy.."Brzycki: 1RM = W x (36 / (37 - R )); "
Wendler adjusts for the 1st rep not actualyl being the max, sort of a partial rep adjust, I guess?
For me the Bryz works better for presses, at least, as addtional failure sets in at higher reps due to muscle fatigue, more so than "Average"
Brzycki is non linear

Code:
Reps      Wendler   Brzycki
1      103.0%   100.0%
2      106.1%   102.9%
3      109.1%   105.9%
4      112.1%   109.1%
5      115.2%   112.5%
6      118.2%   116.1%
7      121.2%   120.0%
8      124.2%   124.1%
9      127.3%   128.6%
10      130.3%   133.3%
11      133.3%   138.5%
12      136.4%   144.0%
13      139.4%   150.0%
14      142.4%   156.5%
15      145.5%   163.6%

Sets values are best guesses with limited experience and references
Most importantly, a single formulas works for all the values and is tweakable. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:33 am
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Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:11 am
Posts: 7578
Location: Kudjip, Papua New Guinea
ephs wrote:
...but i think the creator of the 1rm formula did a good estimate over some big bunch of data.

There isn't just one 1rm formula--there are dozens.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:07 am
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 649
Location: Germany
Jungledoc wrote:
ephs wrote:
...but i think the creator of the 1rm formula did a good estimate over some big bunch of data.

There isn't just one 1rm formula--there are dozens.

i know, i mean the one on the main page

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:09 am
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 649
Location: Germany
what about taking the 5 best 1rm formulas and create a chart of the averages of all calculated sets/reps numbers. did somebody ever do this?

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:26 am

Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:40 pm
Posts: 1142
Location: Lapland, Finland
Where do we need a 1RM formula? Seriously? When are they accurate? Or more accurate than, lets just say, lifting a 1RM?

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:29 am
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 5:44 pm
Posts: 6593
Location: Halifax, NS
Dub wrote:
Where do we need a 1RM formula? Seriously? When are they accurate? Or more accurate than, lets just say, lifting a 1RM?

If you mix your workouts so you vary your rep ranges, it's useful to have some guidelines so you can compare the intensity. That makes the weight selection a little easier. Actually knowing the 1RM is not the point, it's just an estimation tool.

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Stu Ward
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Let thy food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be thy food.~Hippocrates
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Thanks TimD

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:06 am
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 649
Location: Germany
i think you need a 1rm formula to compare your strength, no matter how much reps you train. if you always use the same formula, you can compare your improvements very good. and i'm also interested in statistics, that's why i want to have the ultimate 1rm estimation formula!

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"his hands can't hit what his eyes can't see" - muhammad ali

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:48 am

Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:48 pm
Posts: 1415
Location: New York, USA
Ephs you cannot really have the "ultimate" formula because different people are constructed differently, mostly in the mix of fast and slow twitch fibers, and even for an individual the formula will be different for small muscle moves like Press vs large muscle moves like deadlift.

The "ultimate" formula is actually the collection of formulas and the knowledge of when to use one or another.

I worked out that Wendler's was Good Enough for me by plotting lots of top sets and noticing how well they would predict the same general 1RM for a period of time.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:04 pm
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:12 pm
Posts: 2406
ephs wrote:
that's why i want to have the ultimate 1rm estimation formula!

Mine is the best.

Trust me.

You are getting very sleepy...

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:11 pm
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 649
Location: Germany
ken you are right, we should definately create formulas for every big lift . and with ultimate i meant the most accurate you can imagine.

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"his hands can't hit what his eyes can't see" - muhammad ali

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:12 pm
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
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Location: Germany
maybe oscar can provide charts for single exercises!

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"his hands can't hit what his eyes can't see" - muhammad ali

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:41 pm
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:12 pm
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ephs wrote:
maybe oscar can provide charts for single exercises!

I would tweak the formula underlying this generic one provided

For Arms, I think recovery from sets is easier, but fatigue is quicker within a set

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 Post subject: Re: Top Set % of 1RM for 1 to 5 straight setsPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:42 pm
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Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:17 pm
Posts: 649
Location: Germany
we could throw in all our experiences between the difference of fatigue and recovery at the big lifts and adjust your charts. if somebody is interested also tell your thoughts. the arm experience is a good point.

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"his hands can't hit what his eyes can't see" - muhammad ali

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