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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 2:07 pm 
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Dub wrote:
I don't think there's any ratio. These still are two quite different movements. I wouldn't guess anything. I haven't been on meets yet, but I'll say what the expert's say. I would hit my opener Deadlift two or three weeks before the meet. Build up to your opening single. Louie Simmons has said that your opener should be a weigth you can 3RM when Louie himself comes to wake you up at nigth to lift that damn weigth. So build to a relatively heavy single, a weigth you could do triples with.

That would be my strategy, but I'd love to hear Kenny C's thougths about this.


Well there has to be some ratio, some ration between squat and deadlift and some ration between powerclean and deadlift. The ratio must be there or there is no carry over in training. That's just simple logic. Near as I can tell looking at my training logs my squat/deadlift ratio is 4/5. It may be far to early for me to determine what my PC/DL ratio is.

Well with that advice, and being exactly three weeks out, tomorrow I'll throw in some deadlifting singles, see where I'm at.


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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 12:46 am 
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What's your PR?

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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:02 am 
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b-marz wrote:
Dub wrote:
I don't think there's any ratio. These still are two quite different movements. I wouldn't guess anything. I haven't been on meets yet, but I'll say what the expert's say. I would hit my opener Deadlift two or three weeks before the meet. Build up to your opening single. Louie Simmons has said that your opener should be a weigth you can 3RM when Louie himself comes to wake you up at nigth to lift that damn weigth. So build to a relatively heavy single, a weigth you could do triples with.

That would be my strategy, but I'd love to hear Kenny C's thougths about this.


Well there has to be some ratio, some ration between squat and deadlift and some ration between powerclean and deadlift. The ratio must be there or there is no carry over in training. That's just simple logic. Near as I can tell looking at my training logs my squat/deadlift ratio is 4/5. It may be far to early for me to determine what my PC/DL ratio is.

Yeah sure, there always is a ratio. That's logical. But does it actually correlate and work repeatedly? Power clean is a very technical exercise, with a whole lot of aspects that are not needed in deadlifting. It also reguires different kind of muscle activation and movement patterns.

Deadlifts and squats don't have a correlating simple stated ratio either. Some people deadlift more than they squat. If you train your deadlift and not your squat, the ratio will change and vice versa. If you are weak from lower back, grip or hamstrings, you might have a strong squat but a weak deadlift.

It's not simple. Force production patterns have a correlation. But exercises? There might be some. Having a high power clean migth indicate that you have a high deadlift and a high vertical jump. But there are too many factors to consider before making a ratio in my opinion.

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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 7:17 am 
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Olympic lifters will have a higher power clean:deadlift ratio

Powerlifters will have a higher deadlift:power clean ratio

there's no one size fits all. Same for squat and deadlift. Difference in lever lengths makes it impossible to quantify. Lifters in the lighter weight classes have better deadlifts (generally), and heavier lifters have better squats (again, generally)


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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:43 am 
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Jungledoc wrote:
What's your PR?


Ah, my best before this training was 455lbx2


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 6:15 am 
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New best as of last night. Took the advice, and after the end of my standard workout that I would otherwise do on wednesday I did three deadlift singles with 315lb, 405lb, and 475lb, setting a PR for this year :) so I guess the training works quite well since I've lifted nothing heavier than 295lb in the last month, and did no deadlifting (except for rack pull isometrics on wednesday, but that's one set of 12 seconds at my sticking point), and I pulled 475lb while being anything but fresh.

I'm quite happy today, and my back is also quite happy, not the normal soreness I would have expected after a lift like that. Thank you Kenny!! No deadlifting training may be the best thing I've come across yet!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 7:54 am 
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I GOT 2ND PLACE!

100% Raw Federation, Zion Crossroads VA, June 8th, I totaled 1040lbs and took second place out of, I think it was 11 guys total in the 181 class!

The only thing I don't understand....on my third attempt I went for 485lb deadlift, only ten pounds more than I have pulled in the gym, yet I barely got it off the ground before my back gave out. I don't know what you would properly call it, i guess pulled spinal erectors? I don't think I tore anything, but gosh I'm sore. It's healing fairly qucikly though since yesterday I could hardly get out of bed, and today, I was just sore getting out of bed. Sneezing is no fun though :p

I'm just really surprised this happened. I've NEVER hurt myself like this deadlifting. I mean, I've deadlifting 455 for reps with out issues in the past. I've never had my back just give out. I'm usually able to grind a weight out if I can break it from the floor. I broke this from the floor and thought "yes I've got it!" and then suddenly my back just stopped pulling, and felt it pop like a when a chyropractor does his thing.I dropped the weight immediately. No sharp pain, just stiffness and dull ache. No neurological effects, no radiating pain. I did some hanging and my back when right back into place with ease, so I think my spine is fine, thank God.

The only thing I can think of is that being at the meet all day tired me out more than I realized and my form broke down on my last pull. In strongman, deadlift was one of the the first events, not the last event. I'm hoping all that happened is I underestimated how tired I was and my form just got sloppy. I can fix that, and make dang sure I keep my form in the next meet.

Assuming it was tiredness, I tweaked my training to compensate. I'm adding rack pulls into my routine so Friday will be power cleans, good mornings, and then rack pulls, to make sure my back is used to volume and that I'm keeping my form correct. Besides what some would say, the deadlift is a very technical lift, and if your back isn't in the right position, well I found out what happens. I figure rack pulls should be less strenuous than full deadlifts.

I'm also going to to drop the weight I expect to pull in a meet, since clearly I'm far more tired at the end of it than I realized, I guess I won't ever be pulling PR deadlifts in a meet, which is sad :(


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