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 Post subject: senior trainees
PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 5:40 pm 
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Do you folks here have a place for a trainee who is older to discuss things iron?

I have a few remaining days to be 59. It doesn't seem right that I will be 60, I should be 30 or 39. It is told me that I seem younger than what years I have.

I have exercised with weights, but off and on, since I was in high school. Tempus fugit.

I have never lifted more than 310 pounds, at least in barbell form(timbers can be quite heavy), and that was a deadlift. I am thinking about realistic goals for movements with weights.


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 Post subject: Re: senior trainees
PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:15 pm 
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There are a lot of us here approaching or have reached senior status. You're about average age it seems for this forum.

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Stu Ward
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Let thy food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be thy food.~Hippocrates
Strength is the adaptation that leads to all other adaptations that you really care about - Charles Staley
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 Post subject: Re: senior trainees
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:11 am
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No special place! You just have to get to know the folk here and be wise about taking advice from the younger members without adjusting for your own needs. Actually, that should be true for every person who trains, as there are a lot of factor that should be taken into account in addition to age.

I'm 60. Stu is a year or 2 younger, as I recall. Kenny C is a couple years older.

What are your goals? General fitness? Strength? Hypertrophy? Mobility? Sport prep? Other?

Do you have a routine in mind?

Where do you train? Commercial gym with the usual variety of equipment? Home with limited equipment?

What else do you do? Job active or sedentary? Recreation? Sports?

What is your present level of fitness? Height and weight? History of injuries or medical issues?

Welcome.

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Our greatest fear should not be of failure, but of succeeding at things in life that don't really matter.--Francis Chan


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 Post subject: Re: senior trainees
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:45 pm 
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Thank you for the greeting, Mr. Stu and Mr. Jungledoc,

Goals, yes. I suppose it may be shortly put as strength and health. I need to lose some fatness, I am 230+. My wrists are 7 and 3/4" or a little more.

I have thought I would like to get to squat 400 or so pounds, press half that, at times I wonder how realistic that is. For one, so often it seems like some irritating injury comes along that hampers progress. I have had a few times when my back was injured. My pelvis, a chiropractor said, tends to rotate one way. The chiropractor helped, but then it seemed like I needed an adjustment about every two weeks. After another painful injury from lifting wood or moving some way, my back gave me real problems, so I went to the doc. He sent me to a physical therapist, who thought I had a disc problem that may require surgery, however, was quite willing to advise physical exercise, in sensible progression. "I think it is possible that you may return to activity in life." Thanks glad to hear it. So I have various exercises which help to keep me in half decent shape. It took several months, but things got back on track.

On what goals I have for strength, I am content to proceed slowly, it seems like that is the only productive way of doing things. So since I can just press 130 for a couple of reps, I will be content for that to improve to 140, after a time.

I read about exercise(notably squat style and form) and watch videos of squatting, and other exercises, as I do not want to wind up injured.

I was seeing some progress, however I developed lumber elbow. I call it that, same symptoms as tennis elbow, which bothered me for many years, with some rest coming at times, but I got tired of the constant pain, so I went to the doc again, and was on therapy again, having to stop any significant weight work, having to start with 8 pound DBs. This made me chafe a great deal, but I had to stop, as my way of pushing things along did not work.

For medical situation, I have also had shoulder injury, and some groin pulls, never yet a hernia, although one surgeon thought I did. I am now recovering from a groin injury, gotten from levering some lumber for a customer in a cramped place, and accidentally harming myself.

I am half owner of a small lumberyard that my grandfather started. I do sales, pile wood, prepare orders, help at the sawmill, if need be, run fork lift, pile lumber as it comes from the mill, turn cant hook(turning logs). I haven't sawn, as the sawyer rides on the carriage with the log(on the other side of the carriage than the log, it should be obvious :wink: . That would make me dizzy. When I turn cant I can give my thoughts to the sawyer on what we need to make out of logs.

You asked what I did. I have a good deal of physical work, as well as being at a desk or on a phone quite a lot of the time. So I often am tired from this, and I need abbreviated routines, or a York heavy medium light sort of idea seems to be good.

I am not on any published routine. I basically do warm ups, press, squat, row or stiff legged deadlift, or high pull(I think it is a high pull, at least a high row, calf raise. On some days I do the exercises given me for therapy for the arms, as they are just getting out from that terrible pain. So I do some DB curls presses, raises, wrist curls, etc.

I need some cardiorespiratory sort of work, for cardiorespiratory health, and to lose fatness. That is a problem, as I have early arthritis in some joints(feet, thumb, one hip). So running my doc absolutely would not recommend, and bicycling seems to bother the prostate, and swimming I like, but I cannot afford to drive to a pool. So walking. My feet often will be pretty tired by the end of a day, so brisk walking will not necessarily be the answer, more like a stroll so as not to pound the feet more.

There is not a commercial gym nearby, I have a set of weights at home. A power rack I do not have, finding a place to put it to stay is a problem. I have thought about having a shed with a stove in it. The basement has not a tall enough ceiling to allow for pressing weights over head. I also do not have a bench. So I use a trap bar for such heavier weights as I can use, meaning only up to 190 now, until the groin improves. Just doing a Jefferson lift with 120 pounds has been enough for right now.

Some hindu exercise, some yoga, some pilates sorts of exercise are quite helpful in general health and mobility. I most certainly needed a great many of those sorts of exercises to return to better health.

Sorry for the length, you asked a fair number of questions, which I tried to answer.


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 Post subject: Re: senior trainees
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 1:31 am 
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OK.

To lose fat, the key is diet. As the saying goes "you can't out-exercise a bad diet". So eating less overall, eating mainly "real" food, low on high glycemic carbs, etc., etc.

Squatting 400 seems a bit lofty to me. If you are a relatively-short-limed person who can squat more than you can deadlift, maybe it's not totally unrealistic, but it's a way off.

When you say "press", do you mean bench press? Usually the word press used by itself means an overhead press, such as shoulder press or military press. Bench press of 200+ is possible (that's my PR, by the way).

For cardio, you still have some options. You mention the prostate issue with cycling. They make a specific cycle saddle to help with this. It's like an ordinary saddle, but with a split in the back, leaving 2 parts that support the ishial tuberosities ("butt bones"). A friend swears by these saddles. I have no direct experience with the issue.

It sounds like your training isn't very systematic. I enjoy working out on a fairly random basis occasionally for a few weeks, but for good progress I think you need a plan and a routine. Stick with the routine until there are problems with it, including lack of progress. A written record is valuable, and systematic progression is important.

Given your active work, I'm thinking that resistance exercise 2 or 3 times per week would be plenty. You might want to have 3 workout days, but 2 workouts which you would alternate between the 2 days. Here is a suggested simple routine.

Warm-up. Whatever you like, details aren't critical. Do your therapy exercises as part of this, even after your elbow pain is resolved.

Step-ups, 3x6-10
Bench press 3x5-8
Row of choice, 3x5-8
Lateral raise, 3x10

Trap bar deadlifts, 2x3-5
Overhead press, DB or BB, 3x5-8.
Chin-ups, 3 sets, failure OK on last set
Planks, Roll-outs or Pallof "presses"

Step-ups. Weight with dumbbells, starting with what allows you to do the reps fairly easily. At first progress this by increasing the height of the step. Start at maybe 12", then add an inch or 2 every workout until it's so high that the thigh is nearly level at the beginning of the step. Then progress the weight by small increments, maybe 5 pounds each, if you have 2 1/2 pound plates.

Bench press. Make a bench. Piece of plywood and some 2x4s from your lumber yard. Cover the top with some foam and upholstery material if you like. Or just use a plank on some cinder blocks. If you don't have a rack you can use dumbbells, or have a friend hand the bar to you. You need a rack.

Rows--DB, BB, single-arm, etc.

Lateral raise--keep weight light, lift with the elbows slightly bent, pinky stays higher than the index.

Trap bar--this is the first time that someone asking advice about setting up a routine has had one of these! It's a great tool.

On all exercises start with weight that you can handle fairly easily, then gradually increase. When you can't increase any more, check back here, and we'll argue endless about the many ways to change the routine at that point.

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Our greatest fear should not be of failure, but of succeeding at things in life that don't really matter.--Francis Chan


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 Post subject: Re: senior trainees
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 10:48 am 
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Thank you JungleDoc, for your considered advice. Yes, diet. I think my diet is fairly healthy, it is the snacks that are a problem, like in the evening, I want something healthy, so I have some fruit. Then I want hard tack and cheese, and milk. There are new habits to acquire, and old routines to change.

Lofty, that may be true, this goal. My first goal, after healing, is simply to work up to one workout per week in which I squat more heavily, for me now that would be like 250 lbs for 10 then 15 reps. Then one can proceed from there. I find that it works better to have like 2 workouts per week, due to soreness or just tiredness from work. That York idea of heavy/medium light seems to work well.

You are right, there is not enough regularity to my exercise. It worked while I was letting the tendonitis heal, that was good for me to just do some lighter work. Amazingly, I scarcely notice much pain in the one arm, I thought that may be a lifelong thing. I do have to take some care, as I get enthusiastic about things, like my Dad would, whether at work or in exercise, and then I get myself into difficulties or push too hard. One would think that at near 60 you would become wiser, which I have, but there is still the inclination to bull things around.

I don't bench press, I like the overhead press. I haven't bench pressed in years. It would be good to have a rack, as when I was younger I got tired, and couldn't get the weight up. I had to let it down on my waist(I was on the ground) and then fool around with getting some weights off from the bar. I got bruised. I got a bit scared of the bench press. Mike MacDonald told me that the bench press was the most dangerous lift, and that I needed some kind of a rack. He knew about heavy bench presses. I just stopped doing the bench press, did pushups with weight on my back. John Wood writes that Jim Sutherland will be making a portable rack, I may get one of these, see just what they have going. A bench press of 200 would be fine with me, although if one can get to 200 in the military or overhead press, then one could bench press more. Like I say, 130 is where I am at now for the overhead press, for a couple of reps.

Thank you very much for your thoughts, including on the cardio work, I will ask a friend who works on bikes about this seat. I thought about a comfort seat, but he says they are not really good for you.

Thank you also for your ideas on a routine. Alternating exercises in workouts is a good idea.

I like the trap bar, it is easier than the Jefferson lift. I would like to see some videos on this, as I tend to do more of a squat than a deadlift. Meaning that I let squat down more, like to parallel, possibly lower(I can't see myself), than adopting the deadlift stance when I go to lift. I don't know if this is a good idea, but it is what I have been doing.

Thank you again for your thoughts.


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