Ryan A wrote:
I am probably going to get flamed for this but...
You all must agree that if there were no guns, nobody could ever get killed by one.
However, if there was no violence, but still guns, people could still get killed because of guns.
The fact that guns are often a "no reverse" option is what makes them so dangerous.
So it seems to me like the problem lies in the fact that if regular law abiding citizens can't have guns, then the criminals will find a way to get their hands on them and then there is this large rift of power.
Can we all agree then, that if we could get rid of all the guns, there is no reason to have them around?
To the original discussion, the problem with self defense is, truth be told, action that prevents future attacks, like... hunting down someone that robbed you, or shooting them as they flee, makes just as much sense as shooting them while they are in the process of drawing down on you or whatever. Why? Because there is never certainty that they are not going to try to come back some other time with more weapons and "outgun" you, forgive the pun, escalating to the point where people would have 21st century castles to feel safe.
My point is, I don't just want to not be killed, I don't want to have to deal with being robbed or screamed at or basically have to deal with some idiot at all; this would open up all kinds of shootings for very minor things and make me feel like I needed to wear a bullet proof suit just to walk down the street at night.
nope, no flaming. There are problems with some of those statements though. The first one is a silly hypothetical. It just says that if something doesn't exist it can't kill you. But they do exist so that doesn't really say anything.
The next one would also be true, but it really isn't possible. Maybe when we know everything there is to know about the brain and fix any problems with the instinctual morality of a person. That would involve a lot of knowledge of genes too, because some kind of mutation could be the problem also.
Criminals ignoring the gun laws isn't the only problem. Another problem is creating a black market. In fact current black markets are the main source of the money that funds illegal gun smuggling.
there are legitimate uses for guns. Hunting is one use for example.
Then this is debatable but with many citizens being armed, if the government become oppressive or if another country was somehow able to invade the US, they would find themselves with a nasty insurgency that would make Iraq look like nothing. This is a stretch but it was the point of the constitutional amendment.
So maybe people will loose all interest in guns when our society advances to the point where we can fix any mental issue genetic or otherwise and no longer needs prisons or anything. When people no longer have any illogical fanatical beliefs.
When we reach the point of our ideal utopia, you may be right. But until then, I don't think that's going to work.
According to the violent crime graphs I have seen, the state by state break downs that graph over many years, the best thing that can be done is this. Decriminalize black markets, like drugs. Find a way to increase people's IQ. Convince everyone to be an atheist. Bring everyone out of poverty, to at least a lower middle class standard of living.
The middle 2 are not really possible. The other 2 are though.