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This question isn't so much about healthy diet to build muscle mass. I want to see about getting rid of all (or most) environmental estrogens as possible. I've got what are commonly referred to in most social circles as “bitch tits”. (gynecomastia) I'd get the surgery if I had the money. But I don't have the money. And, just as an experiment I'd like to see if cutting environmental estrogens from my diet, and see what happens. (since the only thing I have to lose I don't want in the first place.) I know that dairy products and meat are full of them. But I want to know what I can replace those with in my diet that I'll actually enjoy eating (I will have none of this tofu/vegan crap going on in my house.) and if there are any foods that suppress estrogen. As an example, the bald eagle almost went extinct because the shells of the eggs were so thin. They got that way because of a pesticide the got on insects, that small birds ate, that were eaten by the bald eagle. If that can happen, how hard is it to believe that synthetic hormones injected into cows, get into the milk and meat, and end up in the people that eat that milk and meat.

Has this kind of thing been tried before?
Has the damage been done adn there's no hope? (I've heard of female to male transexuals experiencing reduction in breast size when starting hormone therapy.)
What is there that has protein that I can use to replace the meats?
Are there places I can buy dairy and meat products that don't use cows sweating estrogen (is it even made)?
If I hade a snowballs chance in hell, exactly what aside from meat and milk do I want to cut (I've heard it can be in fruits and vegetables to, so knowing a list of exactly what TO and what NOT TO avoid is pretty much what I'm reduced to. It's impossible to aviod everything, but if I can just cut the worst of it that'll be enough for me.

Sliver,

I do not know the answers to your questions. HOWEVER, you CAN purchase beef privately. And that's not such a bad idea<g>

For instance, I have a friend who's family ranch sells hay, and they have a SMALL herd of what I call 'happy cows'. He's told me that they sell a few every year.

I don't have a big family at home anymore, but I am still considering buying a freezer for my basement just so I can buy from them. I see the way they are raised and feel like I'd get better beef without the worry of mad cow or hormones.

Depending on where you live, you might be able to find sources for more naturally grown/raised food.

However...I'm not at all certain this would help you with your problem. And it could cost you just as much to search out and purchase these 'natural' products as it would to seek medical assistance.

Have you discussed this with a doctor? Is surgery the only option? Because, following your logic, you'd think hormone therapy would be an option as well as surgery.

I found a LOT of information (including some stuff on environmental estrogens) over on THIS site: http://www.gynecomastia.org/ , which looks to be more of an information site then most I came up with from Google. Gynecomastia mostly brougth up surgical sites.<g>

Good luck!

dian in spokane

I haven't gone through the website yet, but I do know it's getting to be a fairly common problem with kids getting into the adoescent age. males are generating estrogens in a level higher than average. Several possible soures for this. Some actually theorize that gluten (present in MANY foods) are causing raised estrogen levels. I laughed, at first, until I ran across something called Celiac (aversion to Gluten), and have seen that as high as 1 out of 6 people have some of the effects of this.I also noticd that in some of these natural breast augmentation programs they really push wheat products (Gluten is a major portion of wheat and many other grains). So maybe that's not so far fetched. Also, be aware that Testosterone CAN (not necessarily, but can) convert to Estrogens and DHT. Dian is right, discuss it with a physician.
Tim

You could try this link for farmers that raise grass-fed beef and use no hormones.

http://paleodiet.com/FoodVendors/#usa

Keith

I don't need beef and milk bad enough to pay through the nose to get it. BUT, asuming it'll work, I'd prefer avoid the pain, compications, and scar tissue of surgery. Even if I had the money to do it.

That was me I just forgot to sign in.

Found article of some interest (to those with male breasts) Strangley it's on a website about breasts cancer/cysts. However, it does explain about some sources of xenoestrogens AND ways to avoid coming in contact with them.

It's damn near impossible. :(

I buy Laura's Lean beef, which claims to be antibiotic and hormone free (and is also incredibly lean!) Hopefully you can find it at your local grocer. There's a lot of histeria nowadays so I think you should be able to find plenty of organic products.

I don't want to turn into some sugar hating hippie vegan, I just want to cut out the worst of it and see what happens. Thing is, the info I'm looking for is in all the wrong sites. Pills that will get rid of or prevent gyno are on bodybuilding sites for guys that take steriods. Stuff on xenoestrogens are on breast cancer sites. That being the case, finding the stuff I need to know takes all that much longer and is all that much harder.

If I can get something simple that says, "this is where the worst of it is going to be. And this here is going to be the easiest to aviod." I'll be happy.

Going organic looks like it may be a nececity since going vegitarian will be pointless if the pesticides have xenoestrogens too.

Oh, And I would like to add that I consider it BS when I can get 50 times the recomended adult dose of estrogen from a bottle of shampoo but if I want to get something to supress estrogen I need to get a prescription from a doctor and pay through the nose if the HMO/Insurance wont cover it.

I'm an ag guy so I may be a little biased. In all my animal science classes, we learned that there is no way that animal hormones can affect humans, at least via through ingestion. The same people that laugh at others for eating rocky mountain oysters for a "testosterone boost" are the same ones screaming the sky is falling over injected animal hormones. If you

On a side note, wasn't there some research not too long ago that suggested alcohol tend to convert testosterone into estrogen?

Apparently:

http://www.teenbodybuilding.com/bigalcohol.htm

Estrogen is Estrogen is Estrogen. Doesn't matter where it comes from.

If real estrogen from animals can work in humans, who's the say the fake stuff can't?

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