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 Post subject: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:58 am 
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Seen a couple of different grips, not sure how to exactly describe them but...

There's one grip as if your doing bicep curls, (thumb forward) and one where you twist you're wrists so you're knuckles are in front.

I was wondering is there much different for muscle activation? Does one put more focus on the rear delts?

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 12:12 pm 
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It does make a difference but not so much to the rear delts. The difference has to do with internal vs external rotation which changes the contribution from certain rotator cuff muscles. The thumb forward (internal rotation) is the stronger position. Actually neutral is probably strongest (thumbs facing your head). Depending on what you are trying to accomplish, you may wish to do one or the other or both. I won't try to blow smoke at you by suggesting when you might use one over the other but since my shoulder injury I focus more on the externally rotated version. Perhaps someone with more kinesiology background will help out here.

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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 12:13 pm 
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palms horizontal with the knuckles at the top puts much more emphasis on rear delts. A hammer (or neutral grip) puts more focus on upper back.

The orientation of your hands makes quite a difference when doing all types of raises. When you do lateral raises, at the top of the move your pinky should be slightly higher than your thumb. For front raises, to emphasise your anterior delt your thumb should be slightly higher than your pinky.

Quite a good exercise for shoulder development is a barbell front raise where you turn your arms so your elbows are on top. Hits front and side delts.

As I recall this is like your 4th thread about rear delts. If you are struggling to build those bad boys up, try shortening the range of motion ever so slightly on your rear delt flyes, and doing high rep sets (20 - 30 reps). That should blow em up.


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 12:37 pm 
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Both replies seems to suggest knuckles up version would be better for me.

Yeah lateral raises I try to keep my pinky higher, I also try and lean forward a little. But for anterior raises I've been doing them with a hammer grip? And I do all talked about exercises with a slight bend in the elbows.

Barbell front raises? Can I find that in the exercise bit? How come shorting the range of motion?

Yeah I suppose I do want more development, but after my shoulder injuries I'm taking things steadily. Yeah gonna take that advice, doing a low weight/high rep shoulder day, and vice versa.


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 12:44 pm 
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anterior raises with a hammer grip is fine. Slight bend in the elbows is good too.

Barbell front raises are just a cool exercise, especially with the elbows turned over.

I find if I shorten the range of motion on rear delt flyes (don't go all the way up) I feel a much stronger contraction in my rear delts. I can't get much of a burn in them otherwise.

All your raises should be done with low weight/high rep for the sake of your shoulder


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:42 am 
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taking all your advice on board!


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:45 pm 
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Another question, I was wondering how much the triceps are involved in both the grips?


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:33 pm 
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stharrison wrote:
Another question, I was wondering how much the triceps are involved in both the grips?


very little. Not worth considering at all


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:03 pm 
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stuward wrote:
It does make a difference but not so much to the rear delts. The difference has to do with internal vs external rotation which changes the contribution from certain rotator cuff muscles.
I don't agree, rotation does affect the rotor cuff muscles but it also does affect how the deltoid is recruited. Much like how elbows back vs. elbows down for lateral raises matters.

The simple answer: thumbs-up tends to point the elbows down, and this brings the middle head of the delt into play in the rear delt fly. Thumbs-forward (or even moreso with thumbs-down) takes the middle head out so it's more of a strict rear delt movement, although this might allow the teres major and lats to help more.

robertscott wrote:
stharrison wrote:
Another question, I was wondering how much the triceps are involved in both the grips?
very little. Not worth considering at all
Everything's worth considering.

Answer for Harrison: if your elbow is pointing back, the triceps have to contract to keep the arm straight. If they fatigue, the arm will begin to bend, making it easier to lift more weight.

If your elbow is pointing down, the triceps aren't very much involved in keeping the arm straight. It's the outer (lateral) ligaments of the elbow which are under strain to keep the arm in alignment, much like they would in a lateral raise done with thumbs-forward.

This is similar to chest flies: if the elbow is pointing back, the biceps keep the elbow from extending too far, if the elbow is pointing down, the inner (medial) ligaments of the elbow bear the strain instead.


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:55 pm 
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Tyciol you are one strange cookie.

Nobody's triceps have ever fatigued doing rear delt flyes.


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:05 pm 
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robertscott wrote:
Tyciol you are one strange cookie.

Nobody's triceps have ever fatigued doing rear delt flyes.


I'd like to see the delts on that guy, if it happend. (or maybe his triceps, if he had any to see)

Tyciol may just be a more extreme, succint version of Dub


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 Post subject: Re: rear delt fly grip
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:44 pm 
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Oscar_Actuary wrote:
Tyciol may just be a more extreme, succint version of Dub

Nowhere close!

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