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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:53 am 
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Hi All,

So after a few months of Starting Stregth Begginer + Pull Ups I changed to a modified version of the Starr/Mad Cow 5x5 (with 3 top sets so a 7x5 I guess) + Pull Ups. After a few moths off training with serious lack of motivation I've joned a gym (got a freebie through a local community centre) and had 2 sessions with a PT. The initial session was a "What's your experience? What are your Goals? How are you gonna achieve them?" type session. I was on a similar page to the PT, eat moderate to high fat, moderate to high protein and low carb (liek a modified, more supermarket shelf friendly, Paleo), work out 3-4 times a week, use minimal steady state cardio. What I hadn't factored was a change to programming might be needed! I gave him the link to my Journal on here so he could see where I was at before I basically gave up on lifting and he based his program for me on using similar movements, with lighter weight, high rep, circuit styled training with work outs I could get doen in under 30 minutes! Here are the 3 work outs:

Day 1:
Super Sets of 21/14/7
Thrusters
Jumping or Assisted Pull Ups/Chin Ups (alternate pull/chin weekly, BW for as many as possible then assisted)

Day 2:
Circuit once through
Run 400m or Rowing Ergo 800m
50 BW Squats
Run/Row
50 Push Ups
Ron/Row
50 Sit Ups
Run Row
50 back extensions

Day 3:
Circuits of 21/14/7/5/3 (these rep numbers might not be quite right)
Barbell Bench
Deadlift
Lat Pull Down/ TRX Row
Barbell Squat

Warm Up 10 Minutes on a Stationary Bike (or brisk walk)
Cool Down 5 Minutes on a Stationary Bike (or brisk walk) and static stretches

Any thoughts? I was going to start this on Christmas Eve, but I stayed back at work to do a double shift (1.45pm Sunday to 7.30am Monday!) so I think I'll sleep instead! The gym is small, they have a small membership quota and there's been no more than 5 people there when I've been in (not counting those doing fitness classes!), so ti almost feels like the garage away from the garage, which is now full of house crap as we're trying to sell up!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:55 am 
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Also: Weights are "As Tolerated" and remain the same across the sets, the idea is cardio and strength training combined!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 11:38 pm 
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jeffrerr wrote:
Any thoughts?


1 - How long do you plan to be on this program?

2 - What performance targets do you want to meet when the training ends?

You've obviously put in a lot of thought in designing your program. I'd rather hear you comment on how the program actually works in practice than attempt to make an a priori verdict on it.

Merry Christmas, and happy training in the New Year

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:28 am 
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6 to12 weeks, decreased body fat (diet is also changing), increased explosive power, increased cardiovascular ability whilst limiting joint damage/irritation and compacting work outs into small blocks of time because I'm "time poor" right now! Also I didn't put any thought into it, it wasput together for me by a PT!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:35 am 
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jeffrerr wrote:
increased explosive power,!

There is no explosive exercises or training methods in your program. Hence, you might gain a little strength, even though this program isn't good for strength either, and that could give you a little help on explosiveness. But straigth on dynamic/plyometric work? None. So why is that a big goal?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:15 am 
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I think that's a terrible routine


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:51 am 
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y?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:04 am 
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I just think it's weird. Seeing as it's a fat loss routine, but he wants to increase explosive power, I would say that barbell complexes would be a much better choice. They'll build a bit more muscle too than the bodyweight stuff. There's a good sticky about them.

Also, 21 reps of deadlifts? That's weird.

I really don't like the routine but jeff if you like it and it's working for you then by all means keep at it.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:14 am 
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the best for explosive power could be fast squats or the legendary POWER CLEAN.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:32 am 
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ephs wrote:
the best for explosive power could be fast squats or the legendary POWER CLEAN.


The most explosive movement is the second pull in cleans. TimD and Kenny C helped me out with this once. Power shrugs, or hang jump shrugs work that movement directly. Do a search for "jump shrugs" and read all the posts from TimD.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:03 pm 
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jeffrerr wrote:
Also I didn't put any thought into it, it was put together for me by a PT!


jefferr wrote:
I gave him the link to my Journal on here so he could see where I was at before I basically gave up on lifting and he based his program for me on using similar movements, with lighter weight, high rep, circuit styled training with work outs I could get done in under 30 minutes!


Ooops! :red: I should have spotted that, being an Exalted Seer and all. Too busy crying in my beer watching my NY Giants get toasted for the second week in a row.

But back to you, the question you should be asking yourself is whether you're serious about meeting your fitness goals - or are you still haunted by "basically giving up on lifting" in the past? Member KPj has a thread on staying motivated here.

Good luck.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:01 am 
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THE Exalted Seer.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 3:13 am 
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Did you get bored or burned out on lifting heavy with SS every session, and thats why you you moved to Mad Cow's ? And then that got to heavy too often as well, so this routine is a nice break?

it's better than nothing.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:27 am 
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Dub, if thrusters are not an explosive exercise I'll eat my hat!

robertscott I'm glad you elaborated, the 21 reps of deads was wrong, the highest number is 15 in the rep range down to 3 for that day! Also the weightloss with strength maintenance will increase explosiveness, though this something I didn't mention to the PT! In his defense I also didn't mention that he took into account the equipment I have at home so that I can still get a work out done if I can't make it to the gym!

Oscar I didn't so much get burned out or bored with SS/5x5, it was that the rest pauses between heavy sets were pushing my work outs into the 60 to 90 minute range and I just don't have that much time right now so I really needed to compact things down into a short time frame, I need to fit in warm up, work out, cool down and shower into about 60-75 minutes!

As an aside, this is a "Re-Begginer" program, I was finding with the the SS/5x5 I wasn't increasing muscle endurance much and getting worn out before the end of basketball games from a combo of low muscle endurance and still recovering fromteh previous work out!

Anyway, I've only done the first work out once and haven't tried the other 2, I may get a few weeks in and agree with robertscott and think its a terrible routine, I don't know yet!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:28 am 
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jeffrerr wrote:
Dub, if thrusters are not an explosive exercise I'll eat my hat!

Depends.
1) How you do the exercise. Thrusters is a long duration exercise, you have to do every rep explosively or there wont be any. Just doing them is not making it explosive. Think about doing squat jumps slowly. Does that make it explosive training?
2) 21 reps of anything is not explosive training. You can't produce maximal explosive force into the weigth for that long without your nervous system burning and muscles fatiqueing. If you can, the weigth is so low, you most likely aren't really developing maximal force. And when you are fatiqued, it's no longer maximal strength. Hence, it's not explosive. Sprinters don't do several 100 meter, even 50 meter dashes in a row if they want max speed and explosiveness. That's endurance.

For explosive exercises, reps shouldn't last but mere seconds and less. Explosivity is about rate of force development, or POWER. Explosive training and max strength training differ from the fact that explosive reps don't have enough time to produce absolute maximal force. Hence, they try to develop as much force as possible in that time frame.

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