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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 6:26 am 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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While I don't suppose anyone on this forum is naïve enough to think that world class athletes aren't using steroids, this article makes some interesting points anyway

http://romanoroberts.com.mx/steroids-cr ... s-who-how/


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 6:55 pm 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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I don't believe that ALL elite athletes are using, but I do think that PED use is a lot more common than most people realize, especially in sports with little or no testing.


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 9:06 am 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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yeah I think you're probably right.

The most interesting part of the article I thought was the graphs showing how increases in 100m performance coincided with the release on new compounds you can't test for, and the other graph showing how performances in other sports decreased when they started testing for other things.

Quite a coincidence, if nothing else...


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 10:52 am 
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Crossfit appears to be going the way of bodybuilding with regard to steroid usage becoming required by top competitors to win.

Crossfit is starting to make inroads into public awareness, but a steroid scandal will bring that to an end pretty quickly.

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:23 am 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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I agree, however there is a strong bias in this article. The authors have spent their careers helping athletes cheat. They want to believe that everyone is doing it and convince others likewise, in order to justify their actions and the actions of their clients. There's also a bit of a sales pitch here. Use us ... your performance will improve and you won't get caught.


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 12:16 pm 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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I also have to call BS on the FFMI stuff. For example, while Eugene Sandow was an impressive physical specimen, he trained mainly for strength, not hypertrophy. Meanwhile, he made a name for himself at a time when a VERY small percentage of the population was weight training. It's ridiculous to assume that Sandow had the best muscle building genetics of anyone alive at the time, or that his exercise and nutrition were 100% optimal.

Likewise, it's silly to say that because Barry Bonds was a steroid user, no one can reach his level of muscular development without PEDs. Bonds was a baseball player, not a bodybuilder. While he was pretty big for a baseball player, he was small compared to steroid-using athletes in other sports. Meanwhile, there's no reason to think that Bonds' genetics were any better than average with regards to muscle building.


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 3:15 pm 
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Yea, it seems like PEDs only get you there faster but it doesn't seem to be impossible to reach elite crossfit status without them.


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:17 pm 
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Deific Wizard of Sagacity
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Matt Z wrote:
I also have to call BS on the FFMI stuff. For example, while Eugene Sandow was an impressive physical specimen, he trained mainly for strength, not hypertrophy. Meanwhile, he made a name for himself at a time when a VERY small percentage of the population was weight training. It's ridiculous to assume that Sandow had the best muscle building genetics of anyone alive at the time, or that his exercise and nutrition were 100% optimal.

Likewise, it's silly to say that because Barry Bonds was a steroid user, no one can reach his level of muscular development without PEDs. Bonds was a baseball player, not a bodybuilder. While he was pretty big for a baseball player, he was small compared to steroid-using athletes in other sports. Meanwhile, there's no reason to think that Bonds' genetics were any better than average with regards to muscle building.


Yeah the FFMI stuff sounds like a load of $h1t to me too.

Aren't you over the 25 Matt?


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 7:07 pm 
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Powerlifting Ninja
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Stephen Johnson wrote:
Crossfit appears to be going the way of bodybuilding with regard to steroid usage becoming required by top competitors to win.

Crossfit is starting to make inroads into public awareness, but a steroid scandal will bring that to an end pretty quickly.


Scandal

Any scandal that might arise with be a bump in the road, that it.

Look at any other scandal that has come up in sports, politics, etc.

Kenny Croxdale

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 7:32 pm 
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Matt Z wrote:
I agree, however there is a strong bias in this article. The authors have spent their careers helping athletes cheat.


Cheating

It's breaking the rules. However, if pretty much everyone doing it, I am not sure that it is exactly cheating.

Lance Armstrong

What I found interesting about his dilemma was that he was stripped of his first place titles.

However, NO one was awarded his former status. That because it was acknowledged that all the other top finished were using them too.

It's NO different in any other sport.

Quote:
They want to believe that everyone is doing it and convince others likewise, in order to justify their actions and the actions of their clients.


Not So

They are just stating the CrossFit community has joined the rest of those in other sports.


Quote:
There's also a bit of a sales pitch here. Use us ... your performance will improve and you won't get caught.


Romano and Roberts

Evidently, you don't really know who these guys are.

Both are experts in the field. Both are proponents of "Better living through chemistry", so to speak.

For that matter, I don't have any problem with it. I have openly posted my sentiments on this site for years.

Hypocrisy

That American public is compose of hypocrites. They scream about cheaters and the majority of American do or have cheat in other area of their lives...taxes, adultery, going to church then screwing their neighbor on business deals, etc.

American's Bottom Line

"You will be fired faster for playing by the rules and losing that winning by cheating."

Actually, it every cultures creed. It is a part of human nature.

Kenny Croxdale

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 7:36 pm 
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SmokeWillow wrote:
Yea, it seems like PEDs only get you there faster but it doesn't seem to be impossible to reach elite crossfit status without them.


PED

If two athlete are equal, the one on PED's going to blow the other doors off.

You not only get there faster but the elite athlete on PED is going to dominate elite athletes of the same status that aren't on the program.

Kenny Croxdale

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 7:49 pm 
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Matt Z wrote:
I also have to call BS on the FFMI stuff. For example, while Eugene Sandow was an impressive physical specimen, he trained mainly for strength, not hypertrophy. Meanwhile, he made a name for himself at a time when a VERY small percentage of the population was weight training. It's ridiculous to assume that Sandow had the best muscle building genetics of anyone alive at the time, or that his exercise and nutrition were 100% optimal.


Sandow

He worked hard and had very good genetics.

As the saying goes, "You can make a silk purse out of a sow's ear."


Quote:
Likewise, it's silly to say that because Barry Bonds was a steroid user, no one can reach his level of muscular development without PEDs. Bonds was a baseball player, not a bodybuilder. While he was pretty big for a baseball player, he was small compared to steroid-using athletes in other sports. Meanwhile, there's no reason to think that Bonds' genetics were any better than average with regards to muscle building.


Barry Bonds

The odds of someone eclipsing Bond's home run record without PEDs is remote.

Bonds had good "Baseball" genetics.

Power

Making a comparison between bonds and a bodybuilder doesn't make any sense.

Hitting home runs is all about power.

Force = Mass X Acceleration

A player like Bonds stepping into the pitch at 228 lbs with a lot of speed is going to do better than a 185 lb batter with the same bat speed.

Bodybuilding

It is a beauty contest.

Few bodybuilders come close to the strength of a powerlifter.

Few bodybuilders can produce much power.

The emphasis of their training is on size, little time is devoted toward Limit Strength Training.

Virtually NO training time is devoted to power.

Kenny Croxdale

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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 9:22 pm 
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Kenny Croxdale wrote:
SmokeWillow wrote:
Yea, it seems like PEDs only get you there faster but it doesn't seem to be impossible to reach elite crossfit status without them.


PED

If two athlete are equal, the one on PED's going to blow the other doors off.

You not only get there faster but the elite athlete on PED is going to dominate elite athletes of the same status that aren't on the program.

Kenny Croxdale


That's not always the case. PEDs won't turn a work horse into a stallion. I think it's funny how all these athletes are taking drugs but they get there asses whopped time in and time out by usain bolt who's ass weak as a school school.


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 9:25 pm 
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PEDs won't increase rate of force delivery. Like I said, they will get you to your ceiling faster but they will not raise the roof.


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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 8:25 am 
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SmokeWillow wrote:
PEDs won't increase rate of force delivery. Like I said, they will get you to your ceiling faster but they will not raise the roof.


Ignorance

As the saying goes, 'It's better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than open it and remove all doubt'. Mark Twain

Now go to your room and do you home work. :)

PED

Anabolic steroids are just that, "Anabolic". They increase muscle mass and strength.

Now let's see how that works.

Power
"Plyometric Bench Press Training"
http://uspla.org/home/training-articles

First let’s define what power is. Power is equal to force multiplied by distance divided by time.

Power = Force x Distance/Time

Since the terms force and strength are often used interchangeably and distance divided by time is the same thing as speed, power can more simply be defined as strength multiplied by speed.

Therefore,

Strength x Speed = POWER.

"Since strength and speed are components of power, increasing one while neglecting the other limits total power development.

Unfortunately, many players focus on strength because they are familiar with this traditional and well-established mode of training. Because strength and speed have a multiplicative impact on power, athletes can make greater gains if they develop both components. For example, if an arbitrary strength score for an athlete was 2, and the athlete's arbitrary speed score also was 2, the hypothetical power rating would be:

2 x 2 = 4

Doubling strength without altering speed would double power:

4 x 2 = 8

If the same athlete made only a 50 percent gain in strength and an equal gain in speed, the power rating would be:
3 x 3 = 9" (Brittenham, 1997)

Anabolics Blow A Hole Through The Roof!!!

They accelerate muscle mass and strength gains.

They DRAMATICALLY increase your strength levels when you are on them.

As the above illustration demonstrates and increase in strength when on them, translates to an increase in power.

"...They don't raise the roof."

If that were really true, then there would be no reason to band them for athletes who take them during their sports season.

As per statement implied, all steroids do is get you there faster and then EVERYONE catches up. After that everyone on the same footing...natural athletes and those taking them.

Your Education

You clearly have no book smart knowledge of what anabolic steroids are, how they work, etc. Nor you do have any real life experience with them.

Yet, you are an expert in an area you are clueless about.

How does that work?

Kenny Croxdale

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