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The Low-Carb Based Diet/Lifestyle for Fat Loss

Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:45 pm
by ironmaiden708
I am glad that you have come to this page to check out my diet for fat loss. I have gone to a great extent to insure that this information is the most current and accurate. But before continuing on please see your doctor if you have any current health issues and/or making drastic changes to your current lifestyle. If you experience any adverse affects from this diet stop immediately. EXRX and this forum will not be responsible for any and all injuries that could occur.

Hello, this is my newest and I hope greatest version of my fat loss tips article. This diet is not something I came up with all by myself I posted this to summarize information you would find on the internet, but there are parts that I added because it would make sense to go along with this life style. I won't be able to post every single food on here that would be good or bad to eat, it is your responsibility to do a little research and some thinking to see what is a good or bad choice. On another note this may seem like a lot for you to read and absorb and the fact is, it is. When you look at this you may get slightly discouraged and may get overwhelmed by the vast amounts of information. But to start losing weight it will not take you to know all this information or even abide by all of it, which is why they are only guidelines. But as you get more advanced with your diet and get lower body fat percentages you will have to refine your diet to make it near perfect to keep seeing results. So start off slow and work your way up. Good Luck

This diet of mine will be based around a low carbohydrate low starch diet/lifestyle. This is where you limit you intake of carbs from dairy and grains which would include pasta, bread, cereal, chips, etc. The speed at which you want to lose weight will be determined by how strict you are with your carb consumption and if everything else you are doing is correct. One thing which is your responsibility as the viewer is to come up with an exercise schedule to go along with this diet since the exercise is needed to get this diet to work correctly. This diet might work for a little while with no exercise but it will mostly be water weight and muscle.

Low Carb vs. Atkins
You might be thinking of Atkins diet as you are reading my diet plan but there are differences and they should be clarified. Atkins is a low carb diet, but it is a different approach to a similar concept. The Atkins diet has 4 phases, Induction, Ongoing Weight Loss (OWL), Pre-maintenance, Lifetime Maintenance. Induction is the most controversial part of the Atkins diet. This part lasts for generally 2 weeks and the carb intake is only a mere 20 carbs in a day. Things that can go wrong in this part are vitamin deficiencies, bowel issues, and carb crash. The only reason these problems will occur is if the diet is done wrong. It is very easy to do on Atkins. The book consists of 500 pages and you need to read and understand the whole thing to be able to safely and effectively do the diet. My version takes up the length of several pages. The Atkins approach during induction allows you to eat anything you want as long as you don’t pass the 20g of net carbs. You may be thinking, "wow that’s awesome, I can eat all I want", but it's not. Since all you really eat is meat you are getting an excess of saturated fat, which throws off the 1:1:1 ratio of fats (as stated below in greater detail), which should be avoided. My version you won’t have to worry about that, as long as you eat a wide variety of meat, some dairy, veggies, nuts you will be good to go.

I will give a brief explanation of the 3 other phases:
OWL comes after Induction and this is where you raise you net carb intake by 5g per week to find your “Critical Carbohydrate Level for Losing” then stay at that level. After you get within 10lbs of your target weight you then move on to Pre-maintenance phase. This phase is where you raise you net carb intake by 10g per week until you find your "Critical Carbohydrate Level for Maintenance". The last phase is Lifetime Maintenance, this phase is where you take all the things you have learned from the previous phases and apply them on a daily basis to keep the weight off. That is the ‘basic’ version of Atkins. That in my opinion is too complicated of a system to get weight to come off. But if you are up for reading the book and close to obsessively counting carbs then it will work as an effective diet plan.

Low Fat vs Low Carb
Here it is, the clash of the titans. This is a very argumentative subject right here, which one is better in terms of weight loss and overall health? Both diets are used and both sides are convinced their diet is the best.

The approach I will obviously choose is Low Carb dieting, and to start this off with a bang a 2 year study was done to see which was superior and the winner after the study turned out to be low carb dieting by a land slide. They lost the most weight, close to double on average of the low fat dieters. Interestingly enough, the low fat dieters were locked in to the amount of calories they were permitted in a day (1500 for women and 1800 for men) and the low carb dieters weren't. This almost seems like they set up the low carb dieters for failure from a common sense stand point, but it didn't happen.

A lot of misconception revolves around low carb dieting such that it will cause high cholesterol due to all the cheese and meat being eaten. That turned out to be false, the participants who were on the low carb approach lowered LDL (bad) and raised HDL (good) cholesterol, low fat dieters values didn't budge or barely did. Next point is that blood glucose levels were lower in low carb dieters which also means insulin levels are lower which contributes greatly to cholesterol levels and risk of getting diabetes.

This should not be a surprise, it turns out that whole scare that saturated fat is unhealthy and will kill you is all false. That still doesn't mean go on a sat fat frenzy since anything in high enough amounts will do more harm than good. Lower base blood sugar is another part to take note of, diabetics typically will eat on a day to day basis mainly low carb foods since those other forbidden foods they previously ate either caused or contributed to them getting diabetes (not in all cases). On a low fat diet any foods are fair game as long as the fat content is low. That means you can eat sugary low fat cookies or low fat sugar filled yogurt but you can't eat nuts, eggs, meat, cheese, and etc which are foods with great nutritional value to them. Fat does not make you fat, sugar makes you fat since it's the first thing the body easily burns and stores and since fat takes such a long time to break down due to its complexity the body already requires it and doesn't end up getting stored. What is also great is the body might need to pull some fat from the bodies fat stores and burn that for energy since the digesting fat breaks down so slow.

How are you expected to lose much of weight when your body is in a rollercoaster of insulin spiking and crashing? How healthy is a diet where you can't eat various natural foods which truly are healthy and are forced to eat highly processed and expensive alternatives? How easy is a diet to abide by when it leaves you hungry and causes you to crave foods and doesn't allow you to eat many healthy satisfying foods that humans were truly meant to eat? How healthy is a diet which is low fat healthy to abide by when studies have shown that omega 3, omega 6, monounsaturated, saturated in moderation, and even a specific form of trans fat (CLA), all have excellent health benefits which are all not allowed on a low fat diet? Have I made my point? I hope so.

Tidbits of info:

Hierarchy of fatty meats:
In the hierarchy of fatty meats, pork is fattier than beef, beef is fattier than poultry with skin on it, poultry with skin is fattier than skinned poultry, and poultry is fattier than fish...Even though there is some variance that should give you a general idea of your meats.

The breakdown of calories:
7 kcal per gram of alcohol
9 kcal per gram of fat
4 kcal per gram of protein
4 kcal per gram of carbohydrates and sugar

Info on Fats: COMING SOON - 12/17/08

Fat Ratios/Info:
There should be a 1:1:1 ratio of saturated to monounsaturated to polyunsaturated fats in your diet.
Another very important ratio is the Omega-3 to Omega-6 ratio. The best ratio would be 1:1-1:4, but what is seen most often is in the range of 1:20 - 1:100 which are neither ideal nor healthy. The greatest source of Omega-3 in the modern era is through supplementation by fish oil capsules. Foods that are naturally high in omega-3 would be fish, flax, nuts, etc. For more info on the Omega's, read the links below and/or do some research.

Nutrition Labels & Conventional Wisdom
Every single one of us has read a nutrition label before, that Black and white tag located on the back of all foods containers and juice bottles. Well that is something you will need to learn to use quite effectively while dieting. As you are going to the store and picking out foods and are unsure if they are a good or bad choice, read the label. Do the 200 calories consist of sugar and carbs, do they consist of fats and proteins, do they consist of a general mix of all of them, or do they consist of low carbs with high fiber and some fat and protein? One other rule of thumb that will help out greatly is where the food is. Did you find it in a box on a shelf or is it a fresh produce. How many steps did it take to get that food on the shelf? Vegetables and fruits is one step, pick it from the ground. I can't even imagine how many steps it takes to get cookies on the shelf. The general guidelines for picking out foods are to see where the nutrition is coming from and/or to see how simple it is, simple is always better. That's what you must look out for. If you can do all that then I have accomplished one my goal.

My next part of this section is how conventional wisdom plays its part in nutrition. If you were to search the internet for healthy foods you will get a list of foods and general guidelines that look very similar to this link below. You will see many articles like that; they are based around conventional wisdom and a lack of common sense. ... ons_e.html
To quote the article “Avoid snacks that may be high in calories, fat, sugar or salt’”. Only a part of that is right. Yes you must eliminate sugar and you don’t want high calorie snacks. But you do not want to avoid fats. Generally fats are good for you; they maintain a steady flow of nutrients into the body and keep your blood glucose levels stable. The only fats you don’t want are trans fat and high amounts of saturated fat. Salt, everybody thinks salt is bad for you. If you are a perfectly healthy individual who eats good, drinks water, and exercises regularly then sodium should not worry you. So if you want a little salt on your food, go right ahead worry free. Finally the way that this plays a role in nutrition is now you know not to believe everything you read, I have told you what you need to know so if you read a food and it says low sodium or low fat, don’t think anything of the food. It’s put there purposely by companies because they know it will get people to buy it. To further my point if you read the snacks they suggest popsicles, popcorn, cereal w/ milk, low fat yogurt, English muffin, pumpernickel bagel. Milk, popsicles, popcorn is all sugar. The low fat yogurt will have fillers in place of the fat which will be sugar based. Cereal, English muffins, and bagels are carbs all the way through. If you can understand this concept and apply it on a daily basis then I have accomplished another one of my goals.

The snacks I will suggest will have to be partially planned as well but the work to create them is next to nothing. You need to choose a snack that is appropriate for the situation. It depends on the food you already ate. If you just had a piece of fruit then it's not wise to eat another piece after that. With the fruit you would want a fat filled food to slow the digestion of the sugar(s) naturally in the fruit. These foods are suggested snacks by me because they are simple, low carb, healthy fat content, and depending on the one you are looking at high protein content. One more point to make, the snacks may not necessarily be a snack, they can also work as a meal replacement if in a crunch since your are eating 5-8 times in a day and meals consist of only 200-400 calories. That can make a serving size of peanut butter and a small apple a suitable meal.

Suggested "Snacks": Nuts, Peanut Butter, Protein Shake (w/ water), seeds, leftover meat, seafood, fruits, olive oil (1 tblsp), hard boiled eggs, cheese, raw veggies w/ low-carb dip, microwavable pork rinds, homemade jerky, trail mix* , raw tofu, salad with left over chicken w/ tblsp of olive oil, cottage cheese w/ nuts, or any low carb simple foods.

* Trail Mix is a food you must be wary of since there are many variations of it, ranging from healthy to very unhealthy versions. The trail mix you must get has dried fruit, seeds, nuts, does not include any added sugar or candy, and was not deep fried. The best way to ensure that you are truely eating healthy trail mix is to find a recipe and make it yourself.

Anti-Diet Foods
The foods to avoid: Creamy salad dressings, potatoes, popcorn, chips of all kinds, white bread, fatty meats etc. Use your head; you know what to look for.
The foods to eliminate: Sweets (pie, cake, cookies, candy, etc), dairy based deserts, full sugar soda, fast food, juice, etc.

The foods to avoid are generally starchy or are loaded with sugar. Starchy foods start to get digested in the mouth. When it is fully digested it turns into sugar which is something you want to avoid. The exception is the salad dressing, your Ranch and Caesar dressings can easily be abused first off since they are so calorie dense and second you can have another thing in its place that has much more of a nutritional value. The fatty meats might be confusing so let me clarify this, animal fat is what you find in meat (duh!), animal fat mainly consists of saturated fat. If you read above you can see that the ratio of fats should be 1:1:1, when you eat animal fat that balance will be thrown off towards too much saturated fats. The fats you want should come partially from meats and the rest from vegetables and some from grains.

Good to know:
Here are a few supplements that can help to enhance fat loss: Caffeine 200-400mg, CLA 1-3.5g, L-Carnitine 2-4g, Green Tea, Pyruvate .1g/lb of body fat

3500 calories per pound of body fat...not 4086 ... lories.HTM

Links I find to be helpful and informative: ... habits.htm ... ting_2.htm

Some suggested guidelines:

1). Avoid eating deep fried foods; a baked piece of chicken could have 300 calories less than in its deep fried counterpart.

2). Dairy, this for example would be milk, cheese, & yogurt. Here are some general guidelines. Totally skip on the milk, it is composed of sugar and that is something you should avoid. If you want yogurt then get plain full fat sugar free yogurt. Full fat cheese, it's a good snack. Worried about calcium? Don't be, if the rest of your diet is balanced which would include taking a multivitamin then getting the necessary calcium will not be a problem. Be wary of low fat foods, some of these will have added fillers in its place which can make it unhealthy to eat or even more calorie filled than the full fat counterpart.

3). Do not be afraid of healthy fats. These are a very important part of the diet. They slow digestion which will keep you fuller longer and slows the digestion of sugar(s) that may have been in others foods that you may have consumed.

4). If you are in a crunch, protein shakes (water, not milk) w/ 1 serving of peanut butter can make a great meal replacement.

5). Aim for 5-8 mini meals with in a day, this will keep a constant flow of nutrients into the body and you won't get hungry which in turn will lower the possibility of getting those 'evil' cravings.

6). If you are having difficulty with meals, plan them ahead of time. The night before sit down and create a schedule of all the foods you will have the next day and prepare it.

7). If you decide to eat eggs, do not discard the yolks. That is where all the nutrition is. Don't be worried about the cholesterol; as long as your diet is balanced and you are exercising continuously then there are no worries.

8). Since this list is based around a low carb diet/lifestyle (not Atkins!), concentrate any carbohydrate intake that doesn't consist of fruits or vegetables before and after exercising.

9). Avoid high sugar/high saturated fat condiments (or any food except fruit), or at least use them sparingly, try condiments such as mustard or guacamole on your foods.

10). There are many health food products out on the market these days, ranging from Lean Cuisine to Vitamin Water(s). Do not buy any of them. Read the labels of these frozen entrees they tend to be packed with preservatives and generally the nutritional content isn't impressive for a low carb lifestyle. Look at the vitamin content in these drinks, there is insignificant amount for vitamins in the drink. Another negative is the price tag these meals can cost $5 apiece and drinks $1-2 apiece.

11). Make yourself a grocery list before you go to the store; get only what you need and nothing else. Do not buy a bag of Doritos for a rainy day because you know self consciously no matter what you say to yourself you will eventually end up wiping out the whole bag in one day and ruining your diet. If you have children, this would be a great time to get them involved, you get them involved by educating them on how to eat and will keep them healthier. As you know the parents are the most influential people in a child’s life so even actions like this will impact them greatly.

12). Do not avoid oils but have it in moderation/serving size of it, but you must eliminate all partially hydrogenated oils.

13). To try and keep yourself from overeating a specific food, take foods that you buy and break them up into single serving sizes inside of little plastic snack bags. An example, take a bag of almonds and take a 1/4 cup and put it in a snack bag and pack that as a part of one of your meals for the day.

14). Experiment with herbs and spices in your meals. You can make delicious foods broiling foods on a charcoal grill.

15). When possible try to incorporate natural foods over processed foods.

16). Don’t boil your vegetables. It removes precious nutrients; invest in a steamer for your foods.

17). Go with dark green and dense vegetables, it has much more nutrition and will satisfy you longer. Try adding high density vegetables into your daily salad.

18). As a part of your diet, add a strong multivitamin in the morning and fish oil (up to 6 grams). With fish oil you can spread the dosages out throughout the day by taking a tablet at meals you would consider breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

19). Go with whole grain products and avoid bleached, sugary products. Instead of white bread go whole wheat, instead of your white pasta get wheat pasta, go from white rice to brown rice.

20). Defeat the cravings; don't allow yourself to eat the unhealthy processed foods your body desires. Get yourself some sweet fruits and vegetables and munch on those until the cravings subside.

21). Don't drink your calories! Try diet drinks like fruit flavored waters and diet sodas. Or better yet stick with your daily servings of water.

22). Drink plenty of water; it does wonders for the mind and body. Also it may depress the appetite, if you are dehydrated and feel hungry try drinking some water to see if it subsides.

23). Avoid processed foods when possible, a good chunk of the foods are empty calories.

24). Alcohol consumption is not recommended. If you want a drink have a SERVING of red wine to support possible health benefits.

25). Try not to skip exercising routine when possible. It will do you no good except allow you to veg during that time you gave up and cause you to feel guilty.

26). Don't watch the biggest loser and be disappointed if you don't drop as much weight as they do, you got to remember it’s still a reality TV show. 1-2 pounds is a great accomplishment.

27). Be patient if you plateau it’s going to happen.

28). But don't be to patient because that could indicate flaws in your lifestyle.

29). Have yourself set goals at all time to reach this size clothing by this time or drop this much weight in a week. Don't make to demanding of a goal for yourself though because then it will work against you.

30). If you have a party to go to, eat a meal before you go and aim to eat the healthier foods that they are serving you there.

31). Don't poison your mind with media and try to look like those people. Those people generally obsess over their fat loss, have personal trainers, are paid to lose the weight, and/or take drugs to enhance the fat loss.

32). Have a cheat day once in a while, to help keep your diet focused and maybe even use it as a goal for weight loss. Go out to dinner...order a a donut...but don't cheat so much that you lose your progress.

33). Try and get other people involved, it will help to keep you focused.

34). There is NO magic pill for losing weight, it takes time to put on the weight and it will take time to lose it.

35). Take measurements, pictures, and/or bf % before you start dieting. And update it every month or whenever you like to give you a reminder that what you are doing is working and help inspire you to persevere.

36). Most importantly, Don't make dieting a burden on yourself, have some fun to.

I will continually update this, pm me if you want to have any suggestions for additions to my list or if you feel some of my guidelines are out of line or if you have compliments since those are always greatly appreciated.

S/N: ironmaiden708

Version: 1.1

Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:58 pm
by ironmaiden708
If there are any confusions please reply so I can explain and/or make proper adjustments.

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:57 am
by Ironman
Looks good for the most part. I don't think there is any evidence that saturated fat is a problem. I think it is just the ratio of omega 6 to omega 3. You are right about Atkins being confusing, it confused even you. lol Actually it's not confusing, it's just that you have to read a 500 page book. There is no 0 carb diet, and the 20 carb induction thing is only the first part. You can do that for as little as 2 weeks if you want. Plus you are suppose to take vitamins. You have to drink over a certain amount of water and you have to get at least a minimal amount of exercise. Most people just cut carbs and call it Atkins. But if they are not doing all those things, they are not doing Atkins. There are a couple areas where it could be improved but it's a pretty good diet for the most part. I also haven't had any problem eating as much protein and fat as I want. Besides that how much protein and fat can you eat? It is pretty filling. My cutting diet is actually quite similar to Atkins.

But not everyone has to cut carbs that low to lose weight. So you could just say that many people don't have to do Atkins. Atkins got all the fat nazi wrath though, so it has been demonized so bad that people do tend to distance their diet plan from it.

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:34 am
by ironmaiden708
The problem with high saturated fats is that it raises hdl & ldl. Excess LDL is transported to the arteries and is deposited as a plaque on the walls on the walls of it. Which LDL after it is chemically altered (oxidized) is shown to cause a host of health problem. When you eat animal fat it is very easy to get high levels of saturated fat in your body. Besides that, the people who tend to have high saturated fats don't exercise. A person who exercises and has a lot of saturated fat I'm sure would be healthy but I'd rather a person sticks with in the 1:1:1
it's just that you have to read a 500 page book.
Thats the problem w/ it. Nobody will read that. Thats what leads to the vitamin deficiencies. Thats what leads to it being unhealthy. But still though the 1:1:1 ratio is not being abided. Or if it is explain to me how.

This post right here is more of a dry run so chime in any time if you want to argue or anything.

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:27 am
by stuward
That little chart in that link is too simplistic.
Monounsaturated Lowers LDL; raises HDL
Polyunsaturated Lowers LDL; raises HDL
Saturated Raises both LDL and HDL
Trans Raises LDL*

The text does not break it down any finer.

In fat there are many different types of fats within those broad categories. Each has a different effect on cholestrol. You can't say all polyunsaturates are the same and you can't say all saturated fats are the same because they're not.
The Bottom Line: Recommendations for Fat Intake

Although the different types of fat have a varied - and admittedly confusing - effect on health and disease, the basic message is simple: chuck out the bad fats and replace them with good fats. Try to limit saturated fats in your diet, and try to eliminate trans fats from partially hydrogenated oils (a report from the Institute of Medicine has concluded that there is no safe level of trans fats in the diet). Replace saturated and trans fats with polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats.

In general this is true, but once you look beyond the broad categories and look at the specific fats in each, you can find evidence that contradict every statement in this paragraph. The details matter.

Following are some slected quotes from Wikipedia. (very scientific).

Trans Fats:
"Conjugated linoleic acid is a trans fat, though some researchers claim that it is not harmful in the same fashion as other trans fatty acids, but rather is beneficial."
"Some medical research suggests that excessive levels of n−6 fatty acids, relative to n−3 fatty acids, may increase the probability of a number of diseases and depression."
"Butanoate is thought by some to be protective against colon cancer."
"Lauric acid, or dodecanoic acid, is a saturated fatty acid with the molecular formula CH3(CH2)10COOH . It is the main acid in coconut oil and in palm kernel oil, and is believed to have antimicrobial properties."
Palmitic acid: "The WHO reports "convincing" evidence that dietary intake of palmitic acid increases risk of developing cardiovascular diseases. However, possibly less-disinterested studies have shown no ill effect, or even a favorable effect, of dietary consumption of palmitic acid on blood lipids and cardiovascular disease, so that the WHO finding may be deemed controversial. However, another study showed that palmitic acid has no hypercholesterolaemic effect if intake of linoleic acid is greater than 4.5% of energy. On the other hand, it was shown that, if the diet contains trans fatty acids, the health effects are negative, causing an LDL cholesterol increase and HDL cholesterol decrease. "
"stearic acid was less likely to be incorporated into cholesterol esters. These findings may indicate that stearic acid is less unhealthy than other saturated fatty acids."
You can see that this whole issue requires more study and with the amount of money and politics involved it will be some time before detailed, truthful information is out there for the general public.

In summary, I believe:

The 1:1:1 ratio is best.
Other than CLA, trans fats are bad.
Omega 3 should make up 1/2 of the polyunsaturates
Olive oil should be your main added oil
Butter, grass fed meat, fish and eggs are all good for you if you don't overcook them.
There are no healthy processed foods.

BTW, the best source of CLA is grass fed beef.


Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:09 pm
by Ironman
ironmaiden708 wrote:
The problem with high saturated fats is that it raises hdl & ldl. Excess LDL is transported to the arteries and is deposited as a plaque on the walls on the walls of it. Which LDL after it is chemically altered (oxidized) is shown to cause a host of health problem. When you eat animal fat it is very easy to get high levels of saturated fat in your body. Besides that, the people who tend to have high saturated fats don't exercise. A person who exercises and has a lot of saturated fat I'm sure would be healthy but I'd rather a person sticks with in the 1:1:1
it's just that you have to read a 500 page book.
Thats the problem w/ it. Nobody will read that. Thats what leads to the vitamin deficiencies. Thats what leads to it being unhealthy. But still though the 1:1:1 ratio is not being abided. Or if it is explain to me how.

This post right here is more of a dry run so chime in any time if you want to argue or anything.
But the diet doesn't lead to vitamin deficiency. You could say the problem with it is the fact that you have to read that big long book. That would be true. You could also say that Atkins diet doesn't say you have to eat over a certain amount of protein. Those would be factual legitimate complaints about the diet. However the vitamin issue just isn't true. Atkins actually had a whole big program about taking vitamins. Plus look how loaded the Atkins shakes are. Legitimate criticism is fine. We just need to make sure it is true.

So if you want to list the negatives of Atkins, they are:
It is complicated, you have to read a 500 page book to really do it right.
It doesn't have a protein minimum.
It doesn't say enough about the difference between different carbs.

As for the saturated fat thing, we have been over and over and over this in here. There is no evidence. There is actually a lot of evidence to the contrary. Stu brought up a lot of good points I overlooked too.

1:1:1 is just an ideal. Saturated fat doesn't really matter. It is said if you could just get to a 6:1 ratio of 6 to 3, that would be good enough. The problem is it is something like 100:1 in a lot of people.

I'll look at any and all evidence. I'm open minded. People have changed my mind by presenting evidence plenty of times. The omega 3 to 6 ratio for example. I was unaware of that, and didn't think it was right. However after seeing the evidence, I changed my mind am in agreement. So I am very open to evidence.

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:54 pm
by ironmaiden708
What I mean ironman is because some people don't read the book for atkins they do it wrong which means they can get vitamin deficiencies. I need to reword it, no big deal. Its all good. All I want to do is discuss and come up the best and most accurate info possible.

To quote John Berari P.N. pg 14 "Trust me, I know that we are taught to fear the saturates. But this is unneccisary when saturated fat intake is balanced out with a healthy amount of monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fat".

I shall remove the saturates health risks in version 1.1
It doesn't have a protein minimum.
It doesn't say enough about the difference between different carbs.
Can you explain these a little bit so I can make it work.

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:10 pm
by Ironman
I think what he was trying to say is that you can't eat JUST saturated fat. The problem isn't getting to much of that, so much as not getting enough omega 3.

In the Atkins diet, they don't require you to eat a over a certain amount of protein like the protein power diet does. People will probably get enough. BUt they should still stress the importance, since high protein intake is one of the things that keeps a weight loss diet from eating your muscle. The other thing being weight training.

In Atkins they don't do enough to differentiate between different types of carbs. In induction they do stress veggies, You can only eat veggies for your carbs on induction. They also say what kind of carbs you can add in later, but they don't go into quite enough detail as to which kinds of carbs are better and which one should be completely eliminated from the diet. It is a minor point but true and valid.

In fact that is how I do my diet. I take Atkins, add the protein requirement, ban certain foods while allowing going over the carb level if it is done with certain foods depending on the phase. Plus getting essential fats. I also make more phases at different carb levels. But this is just for weight loss. My bulking diet is kind of like a 4000+ calorie version of the zone.

Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 4:46 pm
by ironmaiden708
These are my conlclusions:
The induction phase: 20g a day 2 weeks
-is when vitamin deficiencies can occur when induction lasts for too long or the book isnt read.
-low fiber can lead to bowel issues/constipation - induction
-'carb crash' - induction
-book too big/complicated - things can go wrong.
-not healthy for people with kidney problems

the protein thing is irrelevant. I'm confident if you are on atkins that you are getting enough protein.

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:01 am
by Ironman
The only reason for vitamin deficiencies is not taking the vitamins like you are suppose too. You should always do that anyway regardless of diet. Length of induction doesn't have anything to do with that.

Low fiber only happens if people aren't eating their veggies like they are suppose to, this goes back to doing it wrong.

Carb crash is from going to low with the carbs, the book addresses that too. If 20 is too low for you like it is for some, you are suppose to try 25 by increasing veggie intake.

The diet is not for people with kidney problems.

So I can sum up all the problems, with 1 thing. The people did not read the book. It's that simple, if you didn't read the book, and you aren't following the rules, you are not on the Atkins diet.

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:58 am
by ironmaiden708
Low fiber only happens if people aren't eating their veggies like they are suppose to, this goes back to doing it wrong.
During induction you can't eat much of veggies. Will 2 1/2 cups of brocolli (20 grams carbs) prevent all bowel issues? I was referring specifically to induction.

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:39 am
by stuward
Recommended fibre intake is about 25g. Given that you are limited to 20g of carbs, which includes fibre, it's impossible to get 25g of fibre. However you can get by with less for a while.

2 1/2 cups of Broccoli will supply most people with enough fibre to ward of most problems for the short term. It's not the only vegetable that would work. The green leafy veg are even better in some cases. These include: turnip greens, mustard greens, romaine lettuce, collard greens, swiss chard and spinach.

Also raspberries, celery and cauliflower are also high in fibre and low in carbs.

Many herbs are good as well: cinnamon, basil, coriander, oregano, thyme, rosemary and cloves, although you obviously are not going to eat very much.

Every one of the foods I've mentioned has more fibre than other carbs except celery (47%). Mustard greens are 95% fibre.


Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:47 am
by ironmaiden708
So it does seem possible then but you have to eat smart then. good enough.

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:29 pm
by pdellorto
It's been a while since I was on Atkins, but I thought Induction was 20g of *net* carbs, excluding things like fiber? "Net carbs" was a very big deal on Atkins, which didn't count things like Sugar Alcohol (maltitol) and fiber. So while you couldn't get 25g of fiber while staying within 20g of carbs, you could do it with 20g of "net carbs." I could be misunderstanding or misremembering, it's been more than 5 years since I did Atkins. I did read the book though, but long ago.

I remember Induction well. Lots of urinating on ketosis testing strips and metamucil and ground flax seeds. Not fun but I did shed fat quickly.

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:50 am
by stuward
Pete, that makes a lot more sense.