Form vrs. Function

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If you could have only one, which would you choose?

Peak fitness/athletic performance with moderately good looks.
12
63%
Your ideal physical appearance with moderately good fitness/athletic performance.
7
37%
 
Total votes: 19

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TimD
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Post by TimD » Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:58 am

Actually Hoosegow, it ind of fits into two categories. And tks to you and Matt for the kind words. While I still try to go as heavy as possible on any type of ME day (I try to do at least 2 a week), I realize I'm not seeing any more PR's in that regard. Although, through the CF influence, I do strive for PR's on METCON days in teerms of 1. how many? and 2 . how fast? Going for these types of goals, albeit using bodyweight and moderate weights, keeps my main goal of staying/maintaining fitness and beating back the clock (and the wheelchairs, walkers, etc). I definately don't follow Crossfit to the letter, but rather use them as a source of variety. For instance, I like the Angie workout set up they had scheduled this morning, and it fit right into my orning thing for loosen up/Metcon. I modified it to look like this:
50 Sumo DL HiPull to chin w/35 lb DB's
50 Hanging Leg Raises
50 pushups betwee chairs, feet elevated
50 bodyrows
Total time, 8 mins 23 sec.
A PR for me, although NOT in terms of total
weight, but in terms of how fast, and definately works towards my goal of staying functional. I realize they are MANY varying view points, and I'd like to hear more from the aestetic group.
Tim

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Post by Hoister » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:18 am

I voted in favor of function. For me its a case of wanting to look good in a FIGHT, without caring what i look like in a SPEEDO!

For me its not just about hitting a 500lb dead lift at 5'8" / 180lbs - it's about doing that 500lb deadlift anytime i feel like, without warming up. And NOT about how my ass looks when i bend over to grip the bar.

Its about doing a 100lb/hand farmers walk for 2km - EVERY MORNING and not how my calves look when i walk down the runway.

I really just want to be horrifyingly strong AND well-conditioned without a care in the world about size, shape or image (and its a good thing too, that guy looking back at me in the mirror is one UGLY s.o.b!).

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Post by leif3141 » Tue Apr 03, 2007 1:51 pm

Hmm...I am going to have to go against what everyone else is saying and basically say my reasons are almost purely vainty. I want to look like a greek statuette, not a monster. I'll leave that monster business to the big gorillas in the gym (no offense to those who are...its just not my thing.) I would like to think I am not conceited, but sometimes when I am out in public and I see so many fat uglies (and not fat and muscle...just fat) everywhere I go...its nice to know I am not one of them!

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Post by Matt Z » Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:33 am

Hmmm ... I never meant to imply that function is neccissarily synonimous with being big and scary looking. For example, distance runners train mainly for function, and they aren't usually very muscular. Meanwhile, pro bodybuilders train mainly for form and they look pretty freaky.

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Post by Matt Z » Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:55 am

The best analogy I can make it this. Powerlifters train for strength, while bodybuilders train for aestetics. Both are muscular and strong, but powerlifters are generally much stronger pound-for-pound, while bodybuilders just look stonger. Personally, I'd rather be super-strong, even if I didn't neccessarily look it, than look impressive without the strength to back it up.

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Post by hoosegow » Wed Apr 04, 2007 2:47 pm

Face it. For the most part we are all like car buffs. Some of us go for different things. Tim just wants to keep the jalopy running and reliable and enjoys working on it. Matt and I are the muscle car guys. We don't care what it looks like on the outside. We're going to try to blow your doors off with 900 ponies under the rusty hood. Leif is the custom car guy. We may not be in to what the other is in to, but we can respect and admire it. I'm equally impressed with Ronnie Coleman and (sorry I can't remember the guys name) and guy that just pulled over 1,000 lbs deadlifting in England. Instead of mechanics, we are biomechanics.

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Post by leif3141 » Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:16 pm

Well... since I guess it is defined a little more clearly too me, I would choose a bodybuilder over a powerlifter than. It's not like body builders are "weak"...they just might not be as strong as a powerlifter. But that would be ok to me...I know I am stronger than the average 20 something that isn't into any training at all. Here's the thing...I don't really want muscles that are unnatural looking, and I know this might have become cliched within the last couple of weeks, but I want to look like a spartan in 300. But I wanted to look like that long before 300 came out...and I am pretty damn close to achieving my goal! I might not bench press 500 pounds, or be able to run a marathon, but I am happy with my physical conditioning!

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Post by leif3141 » Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:18 pm

hoosegow wrote:Face it. For the most part we are all like car buffs. Some of us go for different things. Tim just wants to keep the jalopy running and reliable and enjoys working on it. Matt and I are the muscle car guys. We don't care what it looks like on the outside. We're going to try to blow your doors off with 900 ponies under the rusty hood. Leif is the custom car guy. We may not be in to what the other is in to, but we can respect and admire it. I'm equally impressed with Ronnie Coleman and (sorry I can't remember the guys name) and guy that just pulled over 1,000 lbs deadlifting in England. Instead of mechanics, we are biomechanics.
heh...good analogy!

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Post by TimD » Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:20 pm

Well, those were very good analogies given. I would just like to point out a few things. "Back in the day". meaning prior to the late 60's, there really were not many divisions. Most people trained with both "exercises " and "lifts of the day", at that time it was mainly the C and P, Cand J, Snatch, Squat, BP, DL and various compound moves as "exercises", all done with both BB's and DB'sThe guys/gals that like the O lifts did them a bit more often, and those that liked the Odd lifts (now known as the powerlifts), did them more often, and those into bodybuilding did more exercises than lifts. All were terribly strong and fit, and only specialization before contests separated them. A good case in point was Tommy Kono, who won Mr. American, and won medals in four different weight classes in OL. 10 years ago, I was living in Hawaii, Pearl Harbor, where he was in charge of of Parks and Rec, and he was setting up a recreational trail, along the shores of Waikii for both tourists and locls, where you would walk/run/jog along, and then go into stations, where you could P br dip, pull up/ tire run , use the overhed hand ladder, and many other things. Point being, they all compliment each other, and it's a shame that they have all diverged.
Tim

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Post by Ironman » Thu Apr 05, 2007 4:15 am

Speaking of the world record deadlift. The strange thing is bench, squat and deadlift are all close to the same. With squat being the highest, and bench and deadlift about even. Of course bench is with some kind of shirt. Who knows though maybe you get special pants for other 2. hehe :)

I saw a guy at the gym who has his bench and deadlift about the same. Unless you are doing something wrong, I don't see how it is possible for deadlift not to be your highest weight. What do you think?

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Post by Ironman » Thu Apr 05, 2007 4:18 am

Just noticed somebody locked this. Sorry about that. reply in a new thread.

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Post by TimD » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:31 am

It's not locked anymore. Don't know how that happened. This thread is still alive and well.
Tim

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Post by Matt Z » Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:12 am

Actually there are special suits for squatting and deadlifting, but I don't think they make as big a difference as the bench pressing shirts that have become so popular in recent years. Honestly, I think all three lifts should be done raw with just a belt and maybe wraps.

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Post by Matt Z » Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:14 am

PS.) I can definitely deadlift more than I can bench, but not by as large a margin as most guys here. I think it's the T-rex arms. Great for benching, not so good for deadlifts.

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Post by TimD » Thu Apr 05, 2007 11:13 am

As far as raw and equipment goes, well, there are federations out there, and the equipment issue and drug testing issues vary greatly from one fe to another. I you want RAW, thensimply go to AAU and enter one of their raw contests. Although I think the BP shirts and the Squat shorts are kind of a joke (you have to get enough weight on the bar to even get to legal depth in most cases), hey to each their own, and as long as everyone has the approvalto use it, it keeps things on an even keel so to speak.
For some reason, I've noticed over the years, that the smaller weightclasses, say up to around 165 , the trend seems to be they can DL more, and above that it seems like the trend is towards squatting more. Just my observations over the years. Probably has a lot to do with, as Matt stated, bone lengths, the taller/ larger guys have different leverages that the shorter/ smaller guys/gals.
Tim

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