Power training

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slw0096
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Post by slw0096 » Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:31 am

pdellorto wrote:I think I know where you got that 1-set thing. Was it from Matt Brzycki, the Princeton strength coach? I read some of his books a while back, he got me on "one set to failure." I rode that to gains for a while, and then rode it to stagnation for too long. The deal is that yes, one set is enough for beginners...and the first set gets you the vast majority of your gains. This is why even a multiple-set heavy workout like Starting Strength has you deadlift for 1 set of 5 reps and you'll see gains. But the 2nd set adds a bit more, the 3rd set adds a bit more. Not nearly as much percentage wise as the first set does, but enough to make it worth doing. It's "bang for your buck" you are after.
It came mostly from http://www.exrx.net/WeightTraining/LowV ... ining.html

But, I have seen it elsewhere....... It showed that the gains from one set to two and from two to three sets weren't enough to justify the strain, risk, etc. I was and am still getting gains from the one set. My main goal is to maintain the variety so that I don't become bored and continue to gain. Plus, I'm always looking to do something more efficient ex using the bench press to build chest, arms and deltoids rather than using one exercise each (3 total)..... If by adding three sets and dropping the isolation exercises makes it more efficient for the gains, then I'll try it....
Thanks again for the insight.


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Post by slw0096 » Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:35 am

Jungledoc wrote:If the lift is one that you've done regularly before, what Pete said. If any of those lifts are new to you, I'd start where you can do all reps of all sets, with the last few just being a bit of a challenge to good form. Then add weight every workout until you don't make all reps of all sets. The links in the sticky give ways to handle it at that point.

I assumed that you got the 1 set idea from ExRx:
http://www.exrx.net/WeightTraining/LowV ... ining.html
Speaking of, the deadlift will be the only absolute new lift for me, but it's been ages since I've even attempted to do chin/pull-ups. Any pointers to ensure I maintain good form on the deadlift? I've done the straight-leg deadlift. I've read the how to's and seen video for right form, but that exercise worries me; I don't want to hurt my back........

You assume correctly.........

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Post by KPj » Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:18 am

Thought I would jump in with deadlift cues -

Stand close to the bar.
Keep your chest up / out at all times (helps ensure good back position).
Keep a slight arch in your lower back, or just straight, but not rounded.
Core braced and filled with air.
Neck neutral.
Keep your arms straight.
Weight on heels.
Squeeze Glutes

Drive your heels into the floor and pull BACK.
Finish at the top with your glutes (hump the bar) and shoulders in the 'back and down' position, with chest up, and chin tucked slightly.

When lowering back down, remain 'tight' and controlled. Lower first by pushing your hips (always keeping chest up) back and don't bend your knees until the bar has passed them. So hips THEN knees. Not doing this means the bar takes a funky path on the way down - swinging out in front of your body, which will generally cause your back to round.

Other pointers...

Use Chalk if you can...

Keeping the chest up is very important for good back position...


DON'TS
don't round your lower back or let your chest cave in. So don't let your hips tuck under your torso.
don't have your arms bent at the beginning, and don't try and curl the weight.
Don't hyper extend the back at the top position i.e. bending backwards. All your really doing in a deadlift is standing up straight into a good 'military posture', then setting it back down.

KPj

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Post by scs217 » Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:36 pm

One more pointer on the deadlift that Mark Rippetoe pointed out on a video on the crossfit website:

Back in proper position
Center of bar over the center of your feet
*Shoulderblades over the center of the bar (not the shoulders)*
-That means that your actual shoulder joints will be forward of the bar and your arms will come down to it at an angle.

Do that last point and you'll be ok.

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Post by TheHeb » Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:49 pm

Really good advice from KPj and scs217. Like scs217 said, keeping your shoulder blades and not your shoulders over the bar is something that it took me a while to learn but is really important.

One more thing: it's important to be flexible in your glutes/hips/hamstrings when doing deadlifts (and deep squats too, if you're gonna do those). There's a common problem with beginners slightly rounding their backs at the very lowest parts of these lifts (it's hard to notice but your pelvis kinda dips under). I had that problem at first without even knowing it. This especially applies to the deadlift when setting the weight down. My advice is to start stretching consistently.


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Post by scs217 » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:22 pm

In addition to TheHeb's comment on regular stretching, SLDL's with an empty bar just going to the point of a mild stretch and then back up is an excellent pre-workout warmup. When a close DL grip doesn't provide enough stretch then move your hands outward approaching a snatch grip (as far as the very ends of the knurled part of the bar) to get the stretch. In doing the lifts, be conscious of the angle of your pelvis and only go to where your flexibility will allow, because in following repetitions you will achieve the same stretching effect and move closer to full ROM. At the end of today's olympic lifts I was holding my head to my knees on a standing hamstring stretch, and doing PNF seated spinal erector stretches (like a V-Sit) with a partner I was holding my head below the level of my knees. Your workout should add to your flexibility also.

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Post by slw0096 » Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:29 am

I figured I'd revive this thread instead of starting another one.

I've questions posted here: http://exrx.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=34555#34555 if you don't mind helping.....

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Questions about routine

Post by slw0096 » Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:18 am

My goal: To increase strength while decreasing %body fat.

My routine:
Workout A
Squat (3x5)
Bench Press (3x5)
Deadlift (1x5)
Dips (2x12-15)
GHR's (2x12-15)
Rev Crunches (3x12)

Workout B
Squat (3x5)
Overhead Press (3x5)
Pendlay (3x5)
Pull/Chin-ups (2x12-15)
Calf Raises (2x12-15)
Prones (3x30s)

Both routines are followed by Light Cardio (working up to 45 minutes on cross-ramp machine). I keep my BPMs between 60-70% max for my age.

I alternate Workout A & B as ABA then BAB. I have a few questions:

Day 1 last week, I squated 3x5 @ 210 which felt good/easy; on day 2, I squated 3x5 @ 220 - this felt really hard. On day 3, I squated 3x5 @ 230 - On this one, I didn't feel as though I went as far down as I had been. I'm thinking with the amount of weight, once it started to feel really heavy I started pushing back up which I think might have been a bit soon. I do not recall if I did the same when I squated 220 or not. My questions for this scenario are:

1) Should I back down to 220 to ensure proper form (lowering to just below parallel), go up to 225 the next workout and then back to 230 on the following workout?

2) Under what circumstances might I add additional sets i.e. if I get to a weight I just cannot lift 3x5, would I back the weight down a little but add additional sets?

3) I kind of favor the Rev Crunch, but I'm also interested in doing AB pulldowns. Should I alternate between these two or replace prones with AB pulldowns? How benneficial are prones compared to other AB exercises?

4) Are calf raises necessary given the squat and deadlift exercises? I put them in there as to not neglect them and also to keep my workouts balanced.

Just to throw this out there - how can I add less than 5lbs to the bar at the gym? For example, I want to go up 2.5lbs on the bench press instead of 5lbs; they don't appear to have ay 1.25lb weights.

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Post by Johnny » Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:20 am

1. Yes.
2.An additional set can be added in the workout the you can't complete 3x5. However, I used to stall and add it but it didn't help. When you reset, decrease the weight a little but don't add additional sets.
3. Prone is a core exercise. You can do both AB pulldowns and prone, no need for alternating.
4. No, I'd throw in some curls instead. :lol:
5. You can use wrist weight for a small increment.

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Post by Jungledoc » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:44 pm

Did you notice that you're answering a year and half old thread?

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Post by Johnny » Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:21 am

Jungledoc wrote:Did you notice that you're answering a year and half old thread?
I'm sure the thread is old but didn't I post on the same date as OP's last post?

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Post by TimD » Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:28 pm

Yes, you did. Your're current. Slw revived the topic using the old thread just a couple of days ago. The good Doc didn't really pay attention to that.
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Post by Jungledoc » Sun Oct 11, 2009 3:44 pm

Yes. Sorry!
<crawling>

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Post by slw0096 » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:21 am

Johnny wrote: 2.An additional set can be added in the workout the you can't complete 3x5. However, I used to stall and add it but it didn't help. When you reset, decrease the weight a little but don't add additional sets.
I'm using the modified version of the stronglift 5x5. I'm doing 3x5 and just curious as to if/when I would go to 5x5.
Johnny wrote:3. Prone is a core exercise. You can do both AB pulldowns and prone, no need for alternating.
I do Rev Crunches with workout A; would/could I do prones & AB pulldowns with workout B?
Johnny wrote:4. No, I'd throw in some curls instead. :lol:
Trying to stay away from isolation work; only threw calf raises in to help them. Is there any other exercise that I might put in? Am I lacking anything?

- Sorry for any confusion; I figured I'd keep all my questions to the same thread. Keeps everything nicely organized in one central location and pretty much along the same topic...

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alternate body weight exercises

Post by slw0096 » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:23 am

What are some good body weight exercises that I could do if I'm away and can't get to a gym and I can have my kids do to prepare them for weight training:

Squat
Deadlift
Bench Press
Overhead Press
Pendlay (bent over row)


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