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Lunge & Squat on the same "Push" day?

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:03 am
by Alastor
Hello everyone, this is my first post. I hope my question is not too stupid.

I am trying the 2 Day Split Workout (http://www.exrx.net/Workouts/Workout2PP.html) and I would like to know if it's ok to perform Lunge with dumbbells on the Push day, as the first optional Quad exercise.

It looks like that:

Workout A: Push

Quadriceps --> Lunge with dumbbells (long stance?)
Chest (General)
Quadriceps --> Squat
Chest (Upper)
Hip Adductors
Deltoid (Front)
Calves (General)
Triceps
Obliques

Thanks a lot for your help.

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 5:57 am
by Nevage
I do squats and split squats on the same day (similar to lunges). I find it works well because with the squats the weight is heavier and the split squats gets some single leg work in and the weight is much, much lighter so it's a good complimentary exercise.

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:34 am
by stuward
You can do the lunges as a warm up to your squats as you have in your workout but they do make more sense as an accessory lift after your main squat lift. The Hip Adductors don't need to be exercised separately unless you have a special issue you need to work on. Heavy squats and lunges will take care of that.

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:39 am
by Stephen Johnson
@Alastor:
Nevage wrote:I do squats and split squats on the same day (similar to lunges). I find it works well because with the squats the weight is heavier and the split squats gets some single leg work in and the weight is much, much lighter so it's a good complimentary exercise.
Nevage gave you good advice.
Alastor wrote:Quadriceps --> Lunge with dumbbells (long stance?).
Lunges with a shorter step emphasizes the quads, while a longer step emphasizes the glutes.

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:55 pm
by Alastor
Thanks!
Ok so I will keep the lunges. If I do them after the squats, where should it be in the following workout:

Workout A: Push

Chest (General)
Quadriceps
Chest (Upper)
Hip Adductors
Deltoid (Front)
Calves (General)
Triceps

How about after the Chest (Upper)?

Also I understand working the hip adductors could be overkill.
If we consider the Pull workout, is it also pointless to do hip abductors and flexors?

So far my workout is: (with more details vs. my original post)

Push
Glute/Quad DB LUNGE
Chest (General) BB BP
Quadriceps BB SQUATS
Chest (Upper) DB INCLINE BP
Hip Adductors LEVER SEATED HIP ADDUCTION
Deltoid (Front) DB SHOULDER PRESS
Calves (General) SLED 45° CALF PRESS
Triceps BB LYING TRICEPS EXTENSION “SKULL CRUSHER”
Obliques 20-30 WEIGHTED INCLINE TWISTING SITUP

Pull
Back (Lats) PULL-UP
Hamstrings LEVER SEATED LEG CURL
Back (General) DB BENT OVER ROW
Hip Abductors LEVER SEATED HIP ABDUCTION
Deltoid (Side) CABLE UPRIGHT ROWS (shoulder width grip)
Biceps DB CURL
Hip Flexors HANGING LEG RAISE
Trapezius (Upper) DB SHRUG
Abdominal 20-30 WEIGHTED INCLINE SIT-UP

I do 2 workouts with heavy load & 1 set (Monday and Tuesday) then 2 workouts with less load but 2 sets (Thursday and Friday). For all workouts I do a warm-up with 12-15 reps @50% workout weight.

I am also thinking of adding forearms exercises. Any recommendation? (type of exercises, when to do them)

Sorry for the long post and thanks again for your precious help

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:06 pm
by hoosegow
Alastor, there are no stupid questions. You are here to learn and we all can appreciate the confusion of first starting out.

First off, I think you have an excellent program worked out for a beginner. It is well rounded and will give you a good strength base to work off of. You have obviously done your homework. I'd go with what you have.

Scrap the forearm work idea. Everytime you grip, you are working your forearm. There is absolutely no need for almost anyone to work specifically on the forearm (IMO).

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:09 pm
by Jungledoc
For exercise order, you can use the following generalities:

Compound lifts before isolation lifts
Large muscles before small
Lifts requiring a heavy energy expenditure before those requiring less
Lifts that are important to you before those you care less about

I'd scrap the leg adductions.

I agree about the forearm work. It's in your routine already. You even have curls in at one point (yeah you think of curls as biceps, but there is grip and wrist work there, too).

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:20 pm
by caangelxox
One thing I want to mention that no 1 mentioned on here about lunges is make sure when you guys do lunges (the long stride ones) that you don't force yourself longer than what your hip flexibility allows or you will be hyperextending your back and not using your glutes, which is not good. It is just like doing RDL's and trying to get further by rounding your back.

you should also be feeling a stretch in your hip flexors everytime you go down just like in the RDL you feel your hamstrings stretching

Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:24 am
by Alastor
Thank you all, it makes things much clearer.
Just a last point: I will scrap the hip adductors but should I keep the hip abductors and flexors?

Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:01 am
by Jungledoc
Alastor wrote:Thank you all, it makes things much clearer.
Just a last point: I will scrap the hip adductors but should I keep the hip abductors and flexors?
Actually, I skimmed too fast and didn't notice those.

Really, there isn't anything wrong with them; just realize how much more important the squats and deadlifts are. If you want to some of that as assistance work and you have the time, then fine. Just don't think that they will get you as far as the big lifts.

Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:58 pm
by Halfbreed
In agreement with Stu. I would say do the exercises in which you will need the most power, strength, and energy (squats), and work those large muscle groups throughout first, then go to the more isolated exercises such as lunges afterwards.