Put together a framework for fitness-would appreciate advic

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Haffy13
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Put together a framework for fitness-would appreciate advic

Post by Haffy13 » Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:55 pm

Hey everyone, been using this site for a long time but never posted here. I put together a general fitness program for myself based off of this website, starting strength, random tidbits, and what seems to work for me. I'm doing a routine similar to this right now, but am a bit limited since I've been in a rehab facility for almost 4 months and am about to get out. I've only been working out consistently for about 1.5-2 months, and have been making changes this entire time. This is what I plan to do when I get out in a week and a half:

Monday:
Squats 3x5
Bench Press 3x5
Pull-up 3xX(up till 15, then increase weight)

3x10 Depth push ups
3x30 Broomstick twist
3x10 Upper body plyometric medicine ball throws (upwards and downwards)
Variable lower body plyometric routine

Foam roller

Tuesday:
Yoga
Run

Wednesday:
Deadlifts 3x5
Hamstring Curls 3x5
Captains chair sit upts 3xX(up to 15, then increasing difficulty)

Indoor rock climbing

Foam Roller

Thursday:
Run

Friday:
Yoga

Squats 3x5
Press 3x5
Underhand Chin-up 3xX(up till 15, then increase weight)

3x10 Depth push ups
3x30 Broomstick twist
3x10 Upper body plyometric medicine ball throws (upwards and downwards)
Variable lower body plyometric routine

Foam roller

Saturday:
Sprints - 10 sets

Sunday:
Yoga
Run


From my experience, my body can't take lifting the same muscle group 3 times a week, 2 seems to work the best, otherwise I'd be squatting 3 times a week etc. I'm ulso unable to do power training with olympic lifts since there are no drop-plates at the rec center out where I am, nor have I ever had someone teach me the forms, although I have tried to teach my self cleans, with poor results, not that I tried very hard though... Fortunately, the rec center may be getting drop-plates soon.

What I'm really curious is on the running. I have been using the ellipctical to get a general level of cardio fitness, but now since I'll be able to go on runs by myself outside, I'd like to start doing that. I see some programs on the site here and am wondering what to follow. I'm also not sure how to incorporate sprints into my routine properly.

Thanks a lot


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Stephen Johnson
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Re: Put together a framework for fitness-would appreciate ad

Post by Stephen Johnson » Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:32 pm

Haffy13 wrote: I'm doing a routine similar to this right now, but am a bit limited since I've been in a rehab facility for almost 4 months and am about to get out. I've only been working out consistently for about 1.5-2 months, and have been making changes this entire time.
That's a pretty ambitious routine for someone who is undergoing rehab.

Just out of curiosity, rehab from what? An injury?

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Post by Jungledoc » Sun Sep 05, 2010 1:41 am

A few comments about the routine.

Most serious is that there is no rest day, not even one, and you should probably have 2 or 3.

The running is OK if you like to run, but it's more than you probably need for general fitness. Of course, I don't believe you need any for general fitness, but if you want to use it as one of your exercises, that's fine. You could do lots of other stuff for "cardio".

Also, the broom-stick twists (if this is what I think it is) are evil, and should be avoided. Your spine will thank me.

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Post by Haffy13 » Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:40 am

Lol, sorry, I should have been more specific about the rehab, it's drug rehab, not for an injury.

Anyways, I notice that a lot of these running programs seem to have days with a "recovery run". So, I figure that counts towards the recovery day. I'm not sure how cardio factors into recover for weight lifting days, but I chose running over the elliptical because I felt that I was missing that with the resistance of the elliptical machine, however it doesn't seem like that muscle are really being working hard enough, at for now, to consider it active use of that muscle group. Hell, it could even be good getting more blood flowing into those regions. 'Course, I could be completely wrong, but that's why I'm here. Yah, and I do like to run. I feel that getting general cardio fitness is pretty important.

As for the broomstick twists, I can definently give those up and replace them with a different plyometric exercise similar, specifically the one where you turn to the side and throw a medicine ball to a partner... or wall. It's a better exercise anyhow.

Anyways, I'm still very curious about running programs and how and when to incorporate sprints/HIIT into my program.

I'm also thinking that it may be a good idea to switch the underhand chinups for rows.

I'm also curious as to whether I should do my plyometric routine before or after weight training - I've been doing it afterwards as of right now.

Thanks a lot guys, I appreciate it.
Last edited by Haffy13 on Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Jungledoc » Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:22 am

Haffy13 wrote:I feel that getting general cardio fitness is pretty important.
I didn't say otherwise! I just meant that running is not the only way to get it.

You should have at least one day of complete rest. Maybe 1 or 2 other days with light running.

Sprints or HIIT (using any form of exercise, not necessarily just running) will give you the bast bang for your time invested. You can do it in lifting workouts, probably best after weights. You can do it on the same day as lifting, but at a different time of day.


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Post by Haffy13 » Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:26 am

Sorry, I misunderstood you.

Yah, I'd like the cardio to be running. Seems more practical and I can enjoy the outdoors while doing it. I'm also looking into martial arts at the moment, and was considering using that as a crosstraining day instead of running on one of the days. I had originally put the sprints on wednesday after lifting, but got rid of them because of rockclimbing, but I can do that on wednesday too, and no longer on saturday.

Thank you

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Re: Put together a framework for fitness-would appreciate ad

Post by Stephen Johnson » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:04 am

First of all, congrats for following (and soon completing) rehab. You have been given a second chance. Take advantage of it.

My only comment about your program is that you should try it for 4-6 weeks and see what the results are. Then take it from there. Experience is the best teacher.
Haffy13 wrote:What I'm really curious is on the running. I have been using the ellipctical to get a general level of cardio fitness, but now since I'll be able to go on runs by myself outside, I'd like to start doing that.
When switching from exercise machines to running be aware that, except for treadmills, the amount of pounding the body takes from the machines is much less than that from running. Trying to match the cardio intensity of the two right away could lead to shin splints, foot problems and a whole host of other physical problems. Start out easy on the running, until your musculoskeletal system can catch up with your cardio system.

Also, you don't say what type of yoga you're following. If you're doing Vinyasa (or active) yoga, you can include that in your cardio exercises. Six rounds each of Sun Salutations (surya namaskar) A,B and C back to back to back is a workout in itself

I agree with Doc that a rest day per week would be nice, but that's up to you.

Good luck, and happy training.

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Post by Haffy13 » Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:17 pm

I have been following something close to the routine I originally posted for a bit. I'm noticing some lower leg pain, possibily shin splints from using the treadmill, so I'm taking it easy. I'm also wearing vibram five-fingers--so that is something to get used to in and of itself. I haven't done HIIT for awhile, but prefer to do that, so I will add that in.

The days for yoga aren't ideal since I have to go off what is available. The one on friday is at a room my rehab owns and I'll be able to keep doing that for free as an alumni since I'm staying in a sober house in the area. I'd say it's techinically vinyasa, but is pretty muddled and mild since not everyone is onboard or inshape. The tuesday yoga is also vinyasa, but is at a yoga studio. I've been going there weekly for a month or two now-it is pretty intense and can serve as cardio in it's own right. I might change this too since the rec center has a free yoga class with membership, but I've heard mixed reports as to whether it is ghetto or not.

Changed chinups to bent-over rows, and made a change to the plyometric routine. I also added Sunday as a rest day. I may change one of the HIIT days to a kickboxing and/or jiu-jitsu class depending on the feasibility

Alright, so here is how I'm thinking of changing my routine.

Monday:
Squats 3x5
Bench Press 3x5
Pull-up 3xX(up till 15, then increase weight)

3x10 Depth push ups
3x10 Twisting sideward medicine ball throws (really wish I knew the names of these=/)
3x10 Upper body plyometric medicine ball throws (upwards and downwards)
Variable lower body plyometric routine

Foam roller

Tuesday:
Yoga
HIIT

Wednesday:
Deadlifts 3x5
Hamstring Curls 3x5
Captains chair sit upts 3xX(up to 15, then increasing difficulty)

Foam Roller

Thursday:
HIIT

Friday:
Yoga

Squats 3x5
Press 3x5
Bent-over Row 3x5

3x10 Depth push ups
3x10 Twisting sideward medicine ball throws (really wish I knew the names of these=/)
3x10 Upper body plyometric medicine ball throws (upwards and downwards)
Variable lower body plyometric routine

Foam roller

Saturday:
HIIT

Sunday:
Static stretching

Thanks for the help--I appreciate it.

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Post by Stephen Johnson » Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:44 pm

Haffy13 wrote:Alright, so here is how I'm thinking of changing my routine.
Give it a shot for 4-6 weeks and see what happens. If the routine isn't perfect, it isn't the end of the world - you can learn from your experiences. Even if the routine is successful, it won't be the last routine that you'll follow from now onward. Quite a few people would rather spend time developing a routine than actually following one. Don't you be one of those "thinkers not doers."

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Post by Haffy13 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:28 am

I do like making routines, but I've been doing something almost exactly like this for awhile, with only a slight modification. I'm going to wait a week until I'm in the sober house I'm moving to to start HIIT.

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Post by Haffy13 » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:52 am

I had one other question that I forgot to ask. I notice that for a lot of my lifts, I can't do 5 sets or whatever I'm shooting for after the first set. For example, with pullups, Monday I did 7, then 6, then 5. I typically rest 4 minutes between sets, but on Monday I tried a 6 minutes rest for those pullups, and it didn't seem to make a difference. So, what's the deal?

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Post by Jungledoc » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:00 pm

On pullups, I find it good to pace myself. Try doing 5 sets of 4 or 3. Maybe do 5 sets of 3, but on the last set if you still have some reserve, do more. Then next time add 1 to the total:
4/4/4/4/4
4/4/4/4/5
4/4/4/5/5
etc.

With other lifts, if you can't get 5 sets of 5, you're lifting too heavy. Just take weight off, make your sets, then go up a little next time.

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Post by Haffy13 » Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:31 pm

I had that though too doc, but my thought was that 95%+ of the strength gains from lifting come from that first set. So, wouldn't I be shortchanged myself by not lifting as much weight in that set as I possibly could?

An acquaintance of mine was sharing his current program with me, and I got some good ideas from it. He's one of the few people IRL that I know who's knowledge of lifting I respect. I got more than I thought from it, and came up with a weight routine that I'm much more satisfied with. It's similar, but a bit more well rounded. I'd like some advice on it, as I dont plan to change it unless someone here has any better ideas:

Monday
3x5 Deadlift
3x5 Bench Press
3xX Pullups (up to 15 then add weight)
3x5 Turkish Get-ups (these are new to me, is 3x5 appropriate?)
3x10 Medicine Ball Slam

Wednesday
3x5 Squat
3x5 Clean (Similarly, I've only worked on the form for this one before, which I have yet to get down--is 3x5 appropriate?)
3x10 Shrug (Would 15 or 20 reps be better?)
3xX Captain's Chair (up to 15 then increase difficulty)
3x10 Depth Push Up

Friday
3x5 Romanian Dead Lift
3x5 Press
3x5 Barbell Row
3x10 Kettle Ball Swing (this is also new to me, is 3x10 appropriate?)
3x10 Medicine Ball Side Throw (on each side)

Each day I end with a lower body plyometric routine from http://spinalhealth.net/plyometrics.html Each day the routine changes I go from week 3 to 5 then am going to make my own week 6 with more advanced exercises and then go back to week 3 and repeat.

Like I said, I'm very satisfied with this routine. Several of the exercises are new to me, so I'll have to work on the form and an unsure of the proper amount of reps to do. If you see any other problems or have suggestions, that would be awesomes

Thanks

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Post by Jungledoc » Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:29 pm

That's a good, full-body routine. I usually cringe when someone says "I got this routine from a guy I know", as it's usually out of a muscle magazine and completely inappropriate for a novice lifter. So yes, that's a good, solid, well-rounded routine, built around big compound lifts. My only comments are about doing deadlifts 3x5. That's fine at first when you are staying fairly light (see next paragraph) but as the weight goes up you will probably want to decrease the volume, maybe as low as a single set. Rippetoe just uses a single set of 5 of Starting Strength.
Haffy13 wrote:I had that though too doc, but my thought was that 95%+ of the strength gains from lifting come from that first set. So, wouldn't I be shortchanged myself by not lifting as much weight in that set as I possibly could?
I don't think I follow your reasoning. Carrying your logic a step further I'd conclude that a single max rep would be best. You are confusing the single-set versus multiple set issue with other issues of loading. Whether you use single or multiple sets, if you don't use a weight that allows you to do the intended sets you aren't getting the benefits of the program as it was intended.

Any load over 60% of 1RM has potential for strength gain. Obviously, 1 single rep at 60% puts only a little stress on your muscles. That's why you do it more than once! On the other extreme, if you try to lift a weight that you can't lift even once, you get no benefit. What we're doing here is stressing our muscles and our central nervous system to force them to adapt to heavier loads, and thus gain strength. It's not even that simple. We're stressing energy systems, neurotransmitters, we're recruiting motor units, we're learning motor patterns, and on and on. When you exceed your current capacity on any one of them, you can't get the benefit to the others. The weakest link idea. So you have to use a rep-set scheme that stresses the whole system, without exceeding it's present abilities. Lifting too light produces benefit because it causes no stress. Lifting too heavy produces no benefit, because you can't do enough work. In addition, too heavy may exceed your ability to recover.

When beginning weight training, or when starting a new exercise, or when making major changes to your routine, there are MANY benefits from starting relatively light. You are learning motor patterns, allowing your connective tissues to adapt, etc.

You'll find a lot of discussion here about rep-set schemes. 2x3, 3x5, 5x5, 2x10, 2x12, 1x20, and on and on. Each has benefit for somebody's goals. Once you settle on what you're going to use, you need to pick weights with which you can actually do that combination of reps and sets.

I have one other thought about this, but my wife just pointed out that I'm about to be late to a meeting.

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Post by Haffy13 » Thu Sep 09, 2010 8:18 pm

Thanks doc, that makes a lot of sense.

I remember wondering why SS had the 1 set of deadlifts, I figured because it was on the same day as squats. At what point should I start moving doing on sets for deadlifts? Does that also apply to Romanian deadlifts? And why not also squats? and so on and so forth. I'm curious because it's been awhile since I read starting strength


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