What would happen if you eliminated the eccentric phase?

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Haffy13
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What would happen if you eliminated the eccentric phase?

Post by Haffy13 » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:25 am

This is just a hypothetical question. I don't think I've got some genius idea or anything like that. Anyways, here's my line of thought.

I understand that one reason that olympic weightlifting can be done more often than standard weightlifting is because there is no eccentric phase to the motion. (Would setting the bar down instead of dropping it be considered adding an eccentric phase?).

So, what would happen if you eliminated the eccentric phase of, lets say, bench press by having someone lower the weight for you. Would this have a similar effect to olympic lifting allowing for more training? Would doing this compromise gains?

So, does the eccentric phase of a lift put more strain on the muscle than the concentric, requiring more recovery?

The reason I'm asking this is just so I can understand a bit more about kinesiology.


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Post by pdellorto » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:24 am

As far as I understand it:

- you should experience less soreness, as the eccentric portion of lifts are mostly to blame for that.

- you should be able to train more often, because there is less overall demand on your system (you are cutting out half the lift)

- you may lose some muscle gains, because eccentric lifts do seem to add to strength and hypertrophy (there have been studies of eccentric-only training that show good gains)

Anecdotally the first two seem to be true. As much as sled drags and prowler pushes and jumps wear me down, they don't seem to induce a lot of soreness or impact the next day's workout much.

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Post by stuward » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:58 am


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Post by Jungledoc » Sun Feb 27, 2011 8:08 am

Jason Ferruggia recently wrote about doing eccentric-less DLs by dropping the bar on every rep. Claims it allows better recovery while getting good gains. I'm not in a situation where I can drop the bar, so I haven't tried it.

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Post by Paperclip » Sun Feb 27, 2011 10:06 am

There's some good reading material here including about training the eccentric phase:

http://books.google.co.id/books?id=fkx2 ... &q&f=false

I'm too lazy to find the exact paragraph but they found that eccentric training built strength in the eccentric phase with little carryover to strength in the concentric phase. The more I read, the more I'm informed that apparently *a lot* of things are task specific.


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Post by Harpoon » Sun Feb 27, 2011 10:52 am

so whats the conclusion (assuming you're going for hypertrophy)... cause the bulk of training programs Ive seen really stress the eccentric portion... im not saying i want to eliminate it (not practical without a buddy in many exercises)... but do I really need to ie in a bench press spend 3 x longer lowering the bar than powering it up? Its seems like its only possible to do these perfect reps at the begining until you fatigue and you cant control the eccentric rate that well anymore... does that mean i have to lower the weight?

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Re: What would happen if you eliminated the eccentric phase?

Post by Kenny Croxdale » Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:51 am

Haffy13 wrote:I understand that one reason that olympic weightlifting can be done more often than standard weightlifting is because there is no eccentric phase to the motion. (Would setting the bar down instead of dropping it be considered adding an eccentric phase?).


Haffy,

Stu, Peter, Paperclip and Jungledoc provide you with some good information. Let me add to it.

If you are exerting force in setting the bar down, you are performing an eccentric.
So, what would happen if you eliminated the eccentric phase of, lets say, bench press by having someone lower the weight for you. Would this have a similar effect to olympic lifting allowing for more training?


Yes.

Instead of having someone lower the weight down to you (which is a pain in the ass for the spotter), you could place the weight in a power rack at chest level.

Then push the weight up and allow it do drop back down to the pins. I do this.
Would doing this compromise gains?
If all you did was Concentric Only Training, gains will be compromised. As Peter noted, eccentrics are an effective tool in gaining mass and strength.

Thus, exercises that incorporate eccentrics as well as Eccentric Only Training need to be employed in your program to maximize your gains.
So, does the eccentric phase of a lift put more strain on the muscle than the concentric, requiring more recovery?
Yes, eccentric tramatize your body more. That means you need more time to recovery.

Kenny Croxdale

Haffy13
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Post by Haffy13 » Mon Feb 28, 2011 1:13 am

So, lets say I want to increase my deadlift (using this because there is no eccentric phase before the lift). Lets say I could deadlift 3 times a week doing a normal deadlift with both the eccentric and concentric phase. However, if I only did a concentric deadlift, I should be able to tain the deadlift more and thus increase my concentric deadlift much faster than I would be able to otherwise?

I'm not really considering doing this, I'm just trying to put information I've read together and make sure I understand it correctly. Although, I do like the idea of a concentric only deadlift. I took it out of my routine due to the strain of doing deadlifts on recovery. This may be a nice way to add it back in.

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Post by Ryan A » Tue Mar 01, 2011 4:19 am

I definitely don't think it's necessary to lower the weight slowly. I lower pretty much as fast as is safe, and lift it concentrically as fast as possible.


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