Should I deload?

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carlito
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Should I deload?

Post by carlito » Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:00 pm

Hey, back with results after starting to lift religiously 3-4 times a week, not following any known training program. Just sort of doing it my way, but anyways It's been going well, just hit like a wall atm and feel maybe I should deload, I recently started to just take wednesday off in between as sort of a rest, but I've found this week and some of last that I've been so tired that I've had to take afternoon naps after every workout. I'm not entirely sure how exactly I should de load, like take an entire week away from working out, or just not doing any big lifts very intensly, like 5-3-1 or something. What do you guys think? Does anyone here just work out every week of the year or>?

Thought I'd post my 'program' just to give a brief outline of what I'm doing. As said above program can differ a little from week to week, but it's slowly morphed into 2 upper body/lower body split.
day 1: deadlifts, glute bridge, bulgarian split squats
day 2: bench press/one arm db press, incline press, gulotine press, sometimes hip press ups. Band face pulls, elbows out rows, elbows tucked rows.
day 3: which I've yet to do recently because I'm waiting for a squat rack, It's basically gonna be similar to deadlift day, ofcourse replacing them with squats.
day 4: which I don't do every week but, this is just arm day. overhand pull ups, skullcrushers, cable pulldowns, tricep dips, db curls.
on off days i'll do core stuff once a week, also every workout starts with mobility, soft tissue stuff etc.

Anyway admittedley it doesn't give a great idea of exactly how much I'm doing each week, as I can't really put a number to each of them as it's different every workout. The goal is just to build a good base of strength rather than trying to set 1RM records every week as I am a beginner, even though I'm kind of tempted to start 531. Lemme know what you guys think though.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by airhog » Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:58 pm

Your a beginner, The kind of program you put together is for someone advanced. At least this is how I read your post.

Do one of the beginner routines that emphasizes the main lifts like deadlifts, squats, etc.

You don't need half of those exercises when starting out. The goal to great programming is to focus on your weakness, and as a new lifter you are weak everywhere. Once you get a solid foundation you can re-evaluate your lifting goals and add in accessory work as needed.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by Oscar_Actuary » Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:27 pm

I think deload is thrown around too casually.
I'ts like we beginners are too quick to want to be like the cool kids.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by Jungledoc » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:07 pm

If you are feeling burned out, then yes, you should deload. You can just take a few days off. Or, you can do your usual lifts at half the loading and the same reps. Or, you could do different lifts than you usually do, keeping it light.

I sort of agree with what the others have said about your routine. You have tried to reinvent the wheel, and it's not quite round, but it's not square. You've set up a 4 day per week routine, but you say you haven't been doing day 3 lately, and you only do day 4 part of the time. Why not do a 3-day routine consistently?

DL, bench and press are good, and, yes squats are very important--so you should actually do them! If you don't have a rack, just do goblet squats, or single-leg work. 2 or 3 accessory lifts each workout are plenty. You've included plenty of pulling, which is something that many people tend to leave out of home-made routines. So it ain't so bad, but you'd be better off using a good program like "Starting Strength" or "Strong Lifts". Save yourself a lot of trouble.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by nygmen » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:40 pm

carlito wrote:, but anyways It's been going well, just hit like a wall atm and feel maybe I should deload, I recently started to just take wednesday off in between as sort of a rest, but I've found this week and some of last that I've been so tired that I've had to take afternoon naps after every workout.
I will bet you my next pay check it is your diet.

Go ahead and deload, and when you are right back in the same place in 3-4 weeks, then do the following:

Order a large Hawaiian pizza, eat it. Drink a couple full sugar sodas. Make a protein shake (60+ grams) with ice cream, take 1 extra day off and get as much sleep as possible over the two nights before your next lifting day. Then, up your daily caloric intake a reasonable amount, 300 or so is a good starting point.


carlito wrote: Does anyone here just work out every week of the year or>?
I haven't purposely taken more than 2 days off in 3 years. Sickness (mental & physical), work and family have kept me out for (too) longer periods of time, but never by choice have I taken a week off.
Thought I'd post my 'program' just to give a brief outline of what I'm doing. As said above program can differ a little from week to week, but it's slowly morphed into 2 upper body/lower body split.
day 1: deadlifts, glute bridge, bulgarian split squats
day 2: bench press/one arm db press, incline press, gulotine press, sometimes hip press ups. Band face pulls, elbows out rows, elbows tucked rows.
day 3: which I've yet to do recently because I'm waiting for a squat rack, It's basically gonna be similar to deadlift day, ofcourse replacing them with squats.
day 4: which I don't do every week but, this is just arm day. overhand pull ups, skullcrushers, cable pulldowns, tricep dips, db curls.
on off days i'll do core stuff once a week, also every workout starts with mobility, soft tissue stuff etc.
There are worse things you could be doing. If you're married to a 4 way, I posted one that Pete nominated to be added to the sticky, and if others agree I will make a new thread for it where people can have a bit of a Q&A... If your interested I'll link the thread it is currently in. It has a more "appearance" approach than the typical 3x5's or 5x5's and seeing as you have an arm day, I assume that is important to you as well as getting stronger.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by carlito » Wed Jun 22, 2011 3:25 am

@Jungledoc I probably shouldn't have posted my routine, as it's not really accurate, I tend to just pick a few exercises from those lists, and then do a few sets of them. But the main focus is always on the compound lifts. About day 3/4, I don't have a spotter so I do db presses rather than bench press for now. Squats I was doing till recently, but as I upped the weight, It became more difficult to have to lift it off after going near to failure on squats. Still squats is there, for instance yesterdays workout was quite a few sets of deadlifts, followed by 2x glute bridges, then 3 sets of single leg squats. Basically right now not being able to bench and squat is whats stopping me doing one of those programs.

@nygmen I think that's possible, I might not of been getting enough energy/carbs or whatever, I'll take that into consideration. I don't have protein powder or anything but was thinking about getting some, not sure what brand to get though, does it matter?

Yeah I'd be interested to see that routine, thanks.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by Jungledoc » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:32 am

No, it doesn't matter. Cheaper is better. Protein powder isn't a magic potion, just a convenient way to get some protein at work-out time, or with minimal preparation. You could use cottage cheese or milk or meat, or many other sources. Whey powder is absorbed quickly, so some people feel that this is an advantage.

Your routine sounds better now that you explain all this.

Also, I was confused by your terminology. When I hear "DB press" I assume overhead press, not bench.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by carlito » Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:24 pm

Ok, cool, It's just that after reading a few of them, alot seem to contain creatine, should those ones be avoided? as realisticly I want just protein. Right now I tend to have like 2 glasses of milk and alot of meat throughout the day, but milk seems to mess with me a little bit so I'm gonna replace that with the protein shakes.
Also, I was confused by your terminology. When I hear "DB press" I assume overhead press, not bench.
Yeah, my bad, to be honest It's actually a one arm floor DB 'bench' press, just because it's easier to get in position, plus my bench is missing a bolt right now.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by KenDowns » Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:09 pm

I buy protein powder from these guys. It's unflavored and I tend to mix in ice cream (for better or worse). They charge 10.00 for shipping to me, but that comes out to $10.00 USD/lb delivered to my door.

http://www.vitaminherbstore.com/wheypro ... d5lbs.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by carlito » Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:01 pm

This is what I've just ordered http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000 ... ss_product" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . Didn't realise how much this stuff would cost tbh.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by KenDowns » Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:48 pm

carlito wrote:This is what I've just ordered http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000 ... ss_product" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . Didn't realise how much this stuff would cost tbh.
That product is not purely whey protein isolate, and they've put soy protein in there as well. Google "whey protein isolate vs concentrate" to get the idea. Basically: Whey protein isolate is best, all others go downhill from there.

Also google "biological value chart proteins" something like that to see how much of the protein actually ends up in your bloodstream. Isolate again comes out on top.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by nygmen » Wed Jun 22, 2011 10:04 pm

carlito wrote: @nygmen I think that's possible, I might not of been getting enough energy/carbs or whatever, I'll take that into consideration. I don't have protein powder or anything but was thinking about getting some, not sure what brand to get though, does it matter?

Yeah I'd be interested to see that routine, thanks.
http://exrx.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2 ... 095#p72095" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I feel like I'm pimping myself here, lol

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by carlito » Thu Jun 23, 2011 3:50 am

KenDowns wrote: That product is not purely whey protein isolate, and they've put soy protein in there as well. Google "whey protein isolate vs concentrate" to get the idea. Basically: Whey protein isolate is best, all others go downhill from there.

Also google "biological value chart proteins" something like that to see how much of the protein actually ends up in your bloodstream. Isolate again comes out on top.
Thanks for the insight. Didn't understand much about the product, like for instance some of the comments claimed it was also a glutamine supllement aswell. The thing that sold me was that it had 40g of protein per scoop and no mention of creatine.
nygmen wrote:http://exrx.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2 ... 095#p72095

I feel like I'm pimping myself here, lol
lol Thanks, I actually read that thread the other day, just completely forgot about it. Looks a good routine though, apart from I wouldn't be doing the lateral raises.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by nygmen » Thu Jun 23, 2011 6:48 am

carlito wrote:
nygmen wrote:http://exrx.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2 ... 095#p72095

I feel like I'm pimping myself here, lol
lol Thanks, I actually read that thread the other day, just completely forgot about it. Looks a good routine though, apart from I wouldn't be doing the lateral raises.
Why wouldn't you do the raises?

Depending on your answer I have multiple responses.

But... What it really boils down to is this:

You run a routine with an arm day, that you can't recover from, and you don't even squat. This means your diet is awful, your work capacity is awful or maybe both.

You are taking steps to improve your diet, which is a step in the right direction. Just keep the big picture in mind. Doing no sets of raises or doing 6-8 a week isn't going to make or break you, you don't even squat and can't recover.

You shouldn't even be worried about whether or not you would do raises right now.

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Re: Should I deload?

Post by RobertB » Thu Jun 23, 2011 7:19 am

I'm essentially summarizing the above but it reflects my attitude/approach too.

my hierarchy is:
More whole milk (I have a friend who "cant stand milk", I seriously believe those who dont drink much whole milk are missing out on some decent potential)
more sleep*
more calories overall
Deload

I'm on 5/3/1 so it works out, at the end of week three I do feel the need, it is/was really novel, I don't know if it was psychological (i.e. I saw the deload week coming and automatically thought "oh good I need this rest") but it seems to work out perfectly.

Essentially when I am training to a level which gives me that fatigued/downhill slope feeling I throw the least important factor out of the window, vanity - I let the fat come back, I add 1-2lbs, my lifts continue. Isolation really doesn't tax me overall, infact, if I removed all compound big 4, I could probably triple my accessory without overtraining/getting fatigued.

*in regards to sleep, I sometimes cant avoid having 6.5 hours sleep only through the week, so if Im burned out, I turn down social invites to anything thats very casual like just drinking in a bar till 2am. of course if theres a female involved or friends ive not seen in a while I'll still jump at that, but when you get those nights where your sat there at 12:30 ordering another drink thinking "....I'd rather be in bed watching the wire" :wink: you may as well use those nights to recover a little extra to reset your tired system.

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