Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

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teafan
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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by teafan » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:47 am

Is it normal to really feel deadlifts in your lower back? I would expect it to be normal but it also makes me wonder if i'm arching my back too much?


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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by stuward » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:07 am

The lower back should only be challenged isometrically but that doesn't mean it's not challenged. You could feel it anywhere depending on your current conditioning.

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by Kenny Croxdale » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:38 am

Stephen Johnson wrote:It was explained to me once upon a time that the sequence of involvement of muscles in the deadlift is hamstrings at the start, glutes during midrange and quads at the top. I'd be curious to know if this is the case.
Contreras Hamstrings

Contreras has noted that the hamstrings play a vital role in breaking the weight off the floor which makes sense. http://www.wannabebig.com/training/dead ... -champion/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Research shows that in deep Squats and Step Up, the hamstrings are activted to a greater extent when coming out of a low position.

However, the lower back also plays a majory role in breaking the weight off the ground. I have posted this before.

"Biomechancis Of Powerlifting--The Deadlift"
Dr Tom McLaughlin-
Director/Biomechanics Labratory/Auburn University/PLUSA 7/81

"A kinetic analysis permitted us to calculate the resultant muscular torques for the back and legs. This information gives us an idea of whether the back extensor muscles or the quadreceps (thigh muscles) are primarily working to lift the bar at a certain time during the deadlift. How much and when a deadlifter uses these muscles are very important to success."

"Now, although most people probably think the initial drive off the floor is all legs, it is clearly done primarily by the back."

"Kuc, Kazmaier, and Anello use the back first..."

"I was talking to Lamar Gant this week here at Auburn, and he said that he felt years ago his leg drive was strong off the floor, but in recent years he felt his back pulling more at the start."

"This is probably a reason for the recent craze over stiff-leg deadlifts. They simply develop more back strength for the starting position."
http://www.exrx.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6240

Lombard's Paradox

What is interesting is that when deadlifting, both the hamstrings and quads contract at the same time.

Kenny Croxdale

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by commodiusvicus » Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:24 pm

Quick (somewhat) related question: will i develop imbalances if i only do sumo deadlifts, provided i do some extra isolation work?

I've found maintaining good form on (goblet) squats to be relatively simple, but conventional deadlifts are extremely difficult for me to perform because my legs are long relative to my torso/arms, and it's almost impossible for me not to hit my knees with the bar.

I tried sumo deadlifts and the weight felt 20 pounds lighter. Does that mean i should do them like that or does it indicate a weakness that i need to correct?

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by stuward » Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:40 pm

Whichever one works the best for you is the one you should use. There shouldn't be any significant difference between the 2 as far as the effect on your body.


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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by Jungledoc » Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:54 pm

commodiusvicus wrote:Quick (somewhat) related question: will i develop imbalances if i only do sumo deadlifts, provided i do some extra isolation work?

I've found maintaining good form on (goblet) squats to be relatively simple, but conventional deadlifts are extremely difficult for me to perform because my legs are long relative to my torso/arms, and it's almost impossible for me not to hit my knees with the bar.

I tried sumo deadlifts and the weight felt 20 pounds lighter. Does that mean i should do them like that or does it indicate a weakness that i need to correct?
What do you mean, "hit my knees with the bar?" The bar should be in actual contact with your knees as you DL.

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by commodiusvicus » Thu Dec 22, 2011 5:49 pm

Jungledoc wrote:
commodiusvicus wrote:Quick (somewhat) related question: will i develop imbalances if i only do sumo deadlifts, provided i do some extra isolation work?

I've found maintaining good form on (goblet) squats to be relatively simple, but conventional deadlifts are extremely difficult for me to perform because my legs are long relative to my torso/arms, and it's almost impossible for me not to hit my knees with the bar.

I tried sumo deadlifts and the weight felt 20 pounds lighter. Does that mean i should do them like that or does it indicate a weakness that i need to correct?
What do you mean, "hit my knees with the bar?" The bar should be in actual contact with your knees as you DL.
Sure, but i mean they tend to actually obstruct the path of the bar, preventing me from pulling straight up and down. I'm sure at least part of it is due to inflexibility and technique but my thinking is that i can work on strength with the sumo while working on form using light weight with the conventional.

edit: My knees tend to get in the way more on the way down for whatever reason.

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by TimD » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:08 pm

I'm sure others might disagree, but IMHO, it really doesn't matter which one you use. Slightly different emphasis' but if you're both pulling and squatting, it shouldn't matter that much. I think what matters most is what your main reason for doing them is. If you're into OL, Conventional is your choice (mostly to aid in the pulling part of the lift, or at least starting conventional stance in the pull), if you're into PL, use whichever allows you a greater leverage. Sounds like in your case, it's the sumo, and conventionals could be of an aid in assistance choices. For just general getting stronger, general fitness, why not use both . I've dabbled in both over the years, and apparently have leverages similar to yours, so I'd stick with pulls for OL, sumo's for PL. I could almost consistently get close to 100 lbs over my conventional just do to body mechanics.

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by Jungledoc » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:38 pm

I agree with Stu. However, if the knees are obstructing the bar path, that's a technique/form issue. Specifically a set-up issue. You need to start with your feet more under the bar, and the shins more vertical. I didn't say "perfectly vertical" but more so. This will put you in less of a squat position and force your hips to be a bit higher initially.

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Re: Bret Contreras Says Deadlifts are Hamstring Dominant????

Post by commodiusvicus » Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:03 pm

Jungledoc wrote:I agree with Stu. However, if the knees are obstructing the bar path, that's a technique/form issue. Specifically a set-up issue. You need to start with your feet more under the bar, and the shins more vertical. I didn't say "perfectly vertical" but more so. This will put you in less of a squat position and force your hips to be a bit higher initially.
I'll give that a try. Thanks, doc. Thanks to Tim and Stu also.


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