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Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 4:52 pm
by BlazingAirMAx
Is the upright row a pull exercise that can be used to balance out the shoulder press? Some programs recommend balancing the shoulder press with pull ups.

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:10 pm
by Oscar_Actuary
no, its a push, as I understand it.

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:21 pm
by BlazingAirMAx
Oscar_Actuary wrote:no, its a push, as I understand it.
how is it a push?

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:41 pm
by stuward
A push is defined as moving the weight away from the center of the body. This is one of those weird ones. This site call upright row a pull but by their definition, it's a push. It actually uses the same shoulder muscles as the overhead press, just a different part of the arm. Pull ups would be the balancing exercise to overhead press. Upright rows can be used in place of the press.

Edit. The bar actually moved towards the center of the body, then goes past it moving away from the center. The early part of the move is a pull so that must be how they determine the exercise is a pull.
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Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:59 am
by Stephen Johnson
BlazingAirMAx wrote:Is the upright row a pull exercise that can be used to balance out the shoulder press? .
Yes.

The pull up is a better exercise, but a case can be made for upright rows in a routine for a lifter who wants to bring up his shoulders, particularly the lateral deltoid. Both overhead presses and upright rows involve the anterior and lateral deltoid. The difference is that in the overhead press, the anterior deltoid is the target and the lateral deltoid is the synergist. In the upright row, the reverse is true.

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:10 am
by stuward
Stephen Johnson wrote:
BlazingAirMAx wrote:Is the upright row a pull exercise that can be used to balance out the shoulder press? .
Yes.

The pull up is a better exercise, but a case can be made for upright rows in a routine for a lifter who wants to bring up his shoulders, particularly the lateral deltoid. Both overhead presses and upright rows involve the anterior and lateral deltoid. The difference is that in the overhead press, the anterior deltoid is the target and the lateral deltoid is the synergist. In the upright row, the reverse is true.
This ties into the shoulder thread. In the upright row, the arm is rotated down, while in the press, the arm is rotated up. That shifts the emphasis between the anterior and lateral delts. Both exercises still hit both muscles, just to a different degree. In this case, "balance" has more to do with shoulder development, not balancing push/pull.

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:54 pm
by BlazingAirMAx
Stephen Johnson wrote:
BlazingAirMAx wrote:Is the upright row a pull exercise that can be used to balance out the shoulder press? .
Yes.

The pull up is a better exercise, but a case can be made for upright rows in a routine for a lifter who wants to bring up his shoulders, particularly the lateral deltoid. Both overhead presses and upright rows involve the anterior and lateral deltoid. The difference is that in the overhead press, the anterior deltoid is the target and the lateral deltoid is the synergist. In the upright row, the reverse is true.
Would you say that pressing movements such as the military press do not need to be balanced out with pulling movements? Only horizontal pressing needs to be balanced with pulls?

Re: Question about Push/Pull routines

Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:49 am
by stuward
BlazingAirMAx wrote: Would you say that pressing movements such as the military press do not need to be balanced out with pulling movements? Only horizontal pressing needs to be balanced with pulls?
I don't think that's what Stephen implied and I certainly don't believe it. Shoulder health requires that you strengthen the shoulder in all directions. With most rotator cuff/shoulder issues, one of the main articulations the physiotherapists focus in on is shoulder extension. Doing pull ups can prevent a lot of problems. Endlessly doing presses, upright rows and shrugs without chin-ups, pull-ups or pull-overs will eventually cause shoulder issues.