Universal statements of truth.

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Jungledoc
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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by Jungledoc » Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:19 pm

Ok. "Statements of truth" is too broad.

I should have called the thread, "Valid basic training principles" or something. We could get metaphysical and still be on topic, but that's not what I meant.

I wish nygmen was still around!
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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:06 pm

Jungledoc wrote: I wish nygmen was still around!
me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by stuward » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:41 pm

robertscott wrote:
Jungledoc wrote: I wish nygmen was still around!
me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.
But you do it so well.
Stu Ward
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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by Ironman » Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:24 am

robertscott wrote:
Jungledoc wrote: I wish nygmen was still around!
me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.
I'm primarily a bodybuilder.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by JasonJones » Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:37 am

robertscott wrote:me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.
Ironman wrote:I'm primarily a bodybuilder.
Could you share some statements of truth on body part splits or training lagging body parts?
don't you know there ain't no devil
that's just god when he's drunk

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:39 am

stuward wrote:
robertscott wrote:
Jungledoc wrote: I wish nygmen was still around!
me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.
But you do it so well.
Thanks mate!
Ironman wrote:
I'm primarily a bodybuilder.
we need to stick together against this "functional" crowd and their low rep, health and longevity ways. Imagine lifting for health? Madness. Who cares about health when you've an 18 inch upper arm?

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:44 am

JasonJones wrote: Could you share some statements of truth on body part splits or training lagging body parts?
generally speaking, bodybuilding 101 is 3-5 sets of 3-5 exercises per body part, training each part once a week (at least). That's the tried and true way.

However, I'm the wrong person to give advice on body part splits. I can't use them because my poor shoulders can't handle a whole week's worth of chest training volume in one go. I need to split it up into upper/lower sessions.

As for bringing up lagging bodyparts, it's all about the mind/muscle connection. You need an exercise where you can really feel the target muscle working.

Case in point: my lats are a big weakness for me, and pull ups never really seemed to have much effect. However, after including a few sets of straight arm lat pulldowns every upper body session (making sure to really squeeze the lats on each rep), I can feel a much stronger contraction in my lats on all exercises, especially pull ups and rows. Now my lats are slowly catching up but it's a long road.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by Ironman » Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:29 am

JasonJones wrote:
robertscott wrote:me too. I feel I'm the only one flying the bodybuilder flag these days.
Ironman wrote:I'm primarily a bodybuilder.
Could you share some statements of truth on body part splits or training lagging body parts?
Beginners shouldn't use splits, however intermediate and advanced should use some sort of split most of the time. High frequency training can sometimes be an exception to this. Splitting workouts by which angle you hit a muscle group, but still doing full body is one way, and a good one for intermediate. Upper/lower is another very effective split for intermediate. More advanced bodybuilders should only be working everything once a week most of the time, because they need more recovery time. You can do a 3 day split with longer workouts, or you can do 4 or 5 day splits with shorter workouts. 6 or 7 really isn't optimal for any length of time though. You don't grow in the gym, that happens while resting, and you need to eat a lot and get some sleep.

For training a lagging body part you need more volume and more special techniques. For chest you might superset bench with flyes. Upper traps seem to like volume and drop sets. Calves seem to like 6 to 12 reps to absolute failure, even if some of them are half reps, as heavy as you can possibly go. Squat superset with hacks or leg extension is great for quads. For hams, just hit it with more volume. If you are forearm dominant, you might need to do slack wrist curls to force the biceps to move the whole load. A dip/skull crusher superset is great for triceps. For back, it's just plain volume. More sets is a big part of bringing up anything lagging.

I think health and functional training is important for bodybuilding. It's kind of important for everyone really. Bodybuilding mainly just requires more volume and isolation.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:07 am

just to add to what Ironman said there: I would say that an upper/lower split training 4 times a week is perfect for 99% of the population

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by Ironman » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:33 am

Yea, when in doubt, an upper/lower split is a safe bet. That's more likely to be the split you need. It's also going to be a split that will be at least somewhat effective for everyone. I think I probably spent a whole year doing nothing but the upper/lower split. I used to do Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by hoosegow » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:17 am

robertscott wrote: we need to stick together against this "functional" crowd and their low rep, health and longevity ways. Imagine lifting for health? Madness. Who cares about health when you've an 18 inch upper arm?

WHOA WHOA WHOA there little man! FUNCTIONAL?!?!?!? HEALTH?!?!?!? I'm 6'2" and 310 pounds (22.1 stone) and live next to an actual black hole (you may call it a floor, but in my house if it is dropped on the floor it is as good as gone). I'm just a fat guy whose hobby simply is I like to move heavy stuff and I am actually quite good at it so don't you dare call what I do functional or healthy. And 18 inch arms??????? Why would I want to be small?



(take this in jest robert)
Thanks TimD.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:47 am

I love you Hoose

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by hoosegow » Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:55 am

:)
Thanks TimD.

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by robertscott » Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:35 am

oh wait, I just noticed you called me little man!

Godammit I'm sooo close to 200lbs. I retract my "I love you". From now on Hoose, you and I are enemies

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Re: Universal statements of truth.

Post by Jungledoc » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:09 pm

I say you two wrestle to settle it.
Our greatest fear should not be of failure, but of succeeding at things in life that don't really matter.--Francis Chan

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