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CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 12:22 pm
by Vigilius
Would it be overkill for novice trainee to do a very basic (moderate volume) push pull split, 5-6 days a week, in terms of CNS and connective tissue/joint and ligament recovery?

I am thinking of a situation where the muscles themselves will get at least 48h of recovery with the push-pull split and you feel ready to go workout again.

So if you do bench and dips one day, and legs and back workout the next day, then repeat for 5-6 days, then take one or two days off, would that hinder proper recovery and strength gains, even though you feel fresh to workout and fine? My point is, is this constructive or I am just slowing progress even though I feel fine doing it and do get progression my lifts?

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 12:29 pm
by Oscar_Actuary
is it optimal ?
Probaby not. Why not? "cause there is only one optimal and no one here knows what that is

It's working and you like it and you are sticking with it.

So, on that criteria, sure, why not.
Re-asess later.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 12:51 pm
by KenDowns
Ditto what Oscar said.

When you are starting you are not strong enough to stress yourself out. You'll know its time to back off when you dread doing it, start getting weaker, can't sleep, experience messed up appetite, or other weird signs of stress.

Maybe it will work a week, maybe a month, but I'd be surprised.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 1:59 pm
by Vigilius
KenDowns wrote:Ditto what Oscar said.

When you are starting you are not strong enough to stress yourself out. You'll know its time to back off when you dread doing it, start getting weaker, can't sleep, experience messed up appetite, or other weird signs of stress.

Maybe it will work a week, maybe a month, but I'd be surprised.
You'd be surprised that it works for even just a month?

Just to clarify: I am talking of doing this 5-6 days per week, with 1-2 rest days per week. (not repeating 5-6 times after the first two workouts). Sorry if my original sentence was a little convoluted.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 2:46 pm
by KenDowns
Well all I can say is try it. Let us know.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 3:22 pm
by robertscott
It'll work fine as long as you're sensible with volume and intensity. If you want to train that much then consider a bodypart split.

I train 5 days in a row no problem.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 4:54 pm
by Proper Knob
robertscott wrote:I train 5 days in a row no problem.
You've got a jacked shoulder and a bad back.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 7:27 pm
by Vigilius
robertscott wrote:It'll work fine as long as you're sensible with volume and intensity. If you want to train that much then consider a bodypart split.

I train 5 days in a row no problem.
The problem that I could see is that it's easy to give the muscles enough recovery time (48h or more), but training every day you will stress your CNS and connective tissue/ligaments/tendons/shoulder girdle especially with a push-pull every day, because they are being stressed every time you train, not just when you train a particular muscle group.

So thats where I am thinking, with 1-2 days rest per week, will that be enough recovery for the CNS and connective tissue and shoulder girdle particularly, doing so many days of training in a row?

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 11:45 pm
by Dub
There is no overtraining, just under-recovering. That is one of the lessons I have learned. I did 6 workouts a week for 4 weeks (Heavy maximal and explosive training) and didn't kill my nervous system. I even had some other sports going on at the same time. But why was I alrigth? I kept the workouts shorter than when on a lower volume split. I ate and slept like hell. I did prehab and recovering work a lot (Mobility, water therapy, SMR, etc.)

Many bodybuilders have succeeded on training 5 times a week. Olympic athletes can train 10 times a week. So it's not just the number of workouts that causes the issue. Try it out, and listen to your body. Keep ligther workouts or even deload weeks if you feel like crap.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 12:33 am
by Oscar_Actuary
Proper Knob wrote:
robertscott wrote:I train 5 days in a row no problem.
You've got a jacked shoulder and a bad back.
that was dirty

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 12:50 am
by Jungledoc
You won't do any irreparable damage that way, so it is safe to try it and see how you do. If it isn't' working, do something else.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:10 pm
by robertscott
Proper Knob wrote:
robertscott wrote:I train 5 days in a row no problem.
You've got a jacked shoulder and a bad back.
back first went out when I was 15, long before ever touching weights, nothing to do with training 5 days in a row 12 years later.

shoulder is a recurring injury from back when I trained 3 times a week. I actually train less pressing now training 5 days in a row than I did when I trained 3 or 4 times a week, so again nothing to do with training 5 times a week.

Still managed to build more muscle and a better bench than you, smartarse ;)

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:12 pm
by robertscott
Vigilius wrote:
robertscott wrote:It'll work fine as long as you're sensible with volume and intensity. If you want to train that much then consider a bodypart split.

I train 5 days in a row no problem.
The problem that I could see is that it's easy to give the muscles enough recovery time (48h or more), but training every day you will stress your CNS and connective tissue/ligaments/tendons/shoulder girdle especially with a push-pull every day, because they are being stressed every time you train, not just when you train a particular muscle group.

So thats where I am thinking, with 1-2 days rest per week, will that be enough recovery for the CNS and connective tissue and shoulder girdle particularly, doing so many days of training in a row?
meh, CNS fatigue isn't something I would worry about. It's all just internet-induced alarmist hysteria.

Stress on the joints is real though, so program in a deload every now and then.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:48 pm
by Proper Knob
robertscott wrote:Still managed to build more muscle and a better bench than you, smartarse ;)
Can't argue with the latter part of that, not sure about the former. I weigh more than you.

Re: CNS/connective tissue recovery

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 3:04 pm
by robertscott
Proper Knob wrote:
robertscott wrote:Still managed to build more muscle and a better bench than you, smartarse ;)
Can't argue with the latter part of that, not sure about the former. I weigh more than you.
my mistake, I thought you were about 190 and a few inches taller than me. I'm sitting at 195 at 5' 11" these days