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Weight training plus swimming = overtrain?

Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:14 pm
by frogfroggy
Ok I have done weight training for the last 3 months consecutively with a few breaks in between, that was when I was sick or I had actually no time. Now that I dont go to Korean language school anymore I have plenty of time in the morning. So I want to add a swimming program in my workout, but the question is when should I swim? My workout looks like this. 2-day split:

A: ---> mondays and thursdays
Chest 2x10
Lats 2x10
Chest 2x10
Row 2x10
shoulder press 2x10
upright row 2x10

B: ---> tuesdays and fridays
Squats 2x10
Hyperextension 2x10
Lunges 2x10
calves 2x10
biceps 2x10
triceps 2x10
abs and obliques body weight together about 50 -60

I plan now to do A:3 sets B:2 sets and then change to A:2 sets B: 3 sets everything in one week. Then it would look something like this 3x8. So when should I put swimming ? on wednesdays, saturdays? I mean wont my body get abused by this much activity ? :D ^^ There wont be much recovery time between my workout and Im afraid that I will overtrain my body, for I heard on that regeneration is essential in a workout program! Advice please and thanks in advance and sorry for my english, Im german-korean ;D ^^

edit: I also forgot to mention I always do a warm-up set about 30-50% of the original weight ;D

Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:20 pm
by TimD
Your schedule looks fine, (looks like you took it right off the template) so is your English. Yes, you need some recuperation time, but honestly, our weight program doesn't look that intense. I think you can juggle the swimming in there quite nicely at least 2X week. Just keep a close wath on your recuperation. If you start getting tired, just cut back on either the weights or the swimming. Lot's of swim teams here in the US train 5-6 X week with 3 X week weights. Good training

Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:27 pm
by kevin harris
i high school i was a swimmer i trained 6 days a week twice a day

i was a short distance sprinter so the training was intense intervals---i had no muscle mass(becuase i didnt lift) but i literally had veins in my stomach becuase i was so lean

swimming is great cardio

to prevent muscle loss though i would try to keep it 20-30 minutes intense as opposed to longer.

Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2006 1:34 am
by frogfroggy
Perhaps I shall start with once a week and after a month or so I can go up to two times a week. But due to World Cup I have only about 6 to 7 hours of quality sleep ;D going to bed at like 3 in the morning and waking up at 11 in the morning -_-v I wont lose weight though ? right? I mean I want to lose the excess body fat but I dont want to lose muscle mass so you suggest that I do short but intense swim workouts ?

Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:01 am
by TimD
I think Kevin is dead on with the short intense intervals, especially for losing excess fat and keeping the lean mass. Also, get through your weight workouts rather quickly, take about 1 minutes rest between sets. The short rest periods and intervals should jak your metabolism up, i.e. good for fat burning.

Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:28 pm
by Matt Z
I would do hyperextensions after lunges. ..... As for the swimming, I can't help you. I swim well enough to not drown, but that's about the limit of my ability.

Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:21 am
by frogfroggy
Everbody thanks for the great advice, its really helpful.
@MattZ If I do hyperextensions after Lunges wont there be too much of a workout for the quads and wont it lead to imbalance, harms being weak that would lead to injury?

And swim intervals do you mean by doing sprints and then a resting phase and then sprints again ? I think that is intervals... Correct me if Im wrong ;)

Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:29 am
by TimD
Kevin can probably give ou better ideas on interals for swimming, but basically, you have it right. Do a length, catch your breath, go again. Sprint, short rest, sprint. As I said, Kevin could probably give you more specifics.

Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 4:24 pm
by kevin harris
tim hit it right on the nose.sprint short rest sprint

we did 2 lengths at 100% then rested 30 sec, then repeat

a decent strt program would be warmup 5 minute at an east pace then do your sprints
if your in good cardio shape you can start with 2 lenghts if your in not so good shape do one length then rest for like 20 sec then at the end do 10 -15 minutes continuos at a brisk pace.

the sprints were a training program for competitive swimming...but like i said i was extremely lean
keep it short and intense and you will hold your lean mass, we were in the pool for hours so i had no muscle

that is an idea not the answer to fat loss, adjust it to your likes, but like anything you have to push yourself pass the comfort zone to see results( i believe)

kudos to being in the pool i believe it is the best cardio out there

Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 6:48 pm
by strathmeyer
frogfroggy wrote:If I do hyperextensions after Lunges wont there be too much of a workout for the quads and wont it lead to imbalance, harms being weak that would lead to injury?

And swim intervals do you mean by doing sprints and then a resting phase and then sprints again ? I think that is intervals... Correct me if Im wrong ;)
People do lunges all weird sorts of ways and use it to target different muscles. I think the best way to do them is to stick your lunge foot far enough in front of you so that your back knee almost touches the ground and is at a 90 degree angle, and your front knee is at a 90 degree angle. Then I explode my knee forward and up like I'm trying to jump (my back foot comes off the ground slightly.) Other people use at as a quad or hamstring exercise by just slowly going down and coming back up but I've never really understood the benefit of this over other quad or hamstring exercises, whereas I feel this is the best quad exercise.

If you do it my way you'd want to do lunges after back hyperextensions because the hyperextensions work both your lower back and glutes, and lunges just your glutes. You're not really going to imbalance yourself this way, the only concern would be that you may better spend your time by switching these two exercises every work out, but if you have the time you should do both. You should at least try the full variety of exercises that your gym/weights setup allows you.

Also, there's a lot of ways to do swimming sprint intervals. Hopefully that have one of those big clocks with just a big second hand at your pool. That way you can do something such as spring a lap starting every 50 seconds, and then lower that time or do more reps as you get better at it. Also, you can just alternate between sprinting a lap and then slowly swimming a length, like HIIT.

Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 3:23 am
by frogfroggy
Ok swimming HIIT question, after about 5 minutes of easy warm-up, how long should the sprints be? And you stated that the cooldown phase should be like 10 to 15 minutes at a"brisk pace" ? Is it good to vary the swim styles when I cool down? And for the sprints freestyle is the best for it right ?

I did some research and I am ready to go for it ;D it sounds so much fun ^^But nothing stated how long or how many laps. I only hope that I wont cramp up cause a day before that (tueday,friday) I do my legs.. So I hope it wont affect the next day (wednesday, saturday). But I think Ill do trial and error and see how my body responds !

Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 8:43 am
by TimD
Hi Froggy, I think you have the basics down. One thing, though. I think that you are way overanalyzing this. There really are no hard fast rules. As to how far should the laps be, well I have no idea how long your pool is, but I would think 1 - 2 lengths could be a good sprint. As to cool down, do whatever you feel, could be tread water, could be roll over on your back and do a light "stay afloat", could be walking through the water. As to change of styles or strokes, by all means, if you feel like it, do it.I'll just give an example. When I was a kid, I took a bet against a guy who told me I couldn't swim the distance of the width of a local lake (probably about a half mile). I started out with the crawl, when I got tire I rolled over and did a moderate side stroke, then went to the breast stroke with renewed energy, and kept switching off til I got to the other side. I guess what I'm saying, is do what works for you. Other than the basics of intervals, being sprint, short "rest" , there really are hard fast rules such as strokes, lengths, etc
Just dive on in and enjoy it.