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Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 4:34 am
by KPj
I think it's a bit of everything.

There's deffinitly people out there who just need banged on the head and told to wise up. You know, the people who eat loads of crap every day but are constantly on a diet, generally have been on a diet for aslong as people have known them, yet, they just get fatter, and every time you see them they're eating some kind of crap. They shy away from any kinf od solution that involves a little hard work, thought, or discipline or change.

Then you have the people that really make an effort. They might join a gym and/or attend some kind of diet class. It's these people that I feel most sorry for. They've done one of the hardest parts, admitted they have a problem that needs help from someone else who knows more about it than they do. They seek out these people that know more about it - trainers or 'diet class people' (can't bring myself to call them dieticians or nutritionists), and they get told a lot of junk information. Follow the advice (because they don't know any better), normally lose a little weight over the first 1-3months, it comes back on or stagnates, they don't get anywhere near where they want to or need to be, get disheartened, and slip back into their old ways...

You could blame parents, too. However, the parents could just be the subject of the 2 categories above - people who need banged on the head, and people who unfortunately make the effort but just follow the wrong advice.

The goverment is pretty ignorant too. I mean, the research is out there, why don't they know about it? I also have read all the latest british heart foundation diet recommendations and it's full of contradictions. You don't even need to find an opposing argument, it's right there in the little hand books they give out to people more at risk to heart issues (my dad). On one hand they tell you something is good (like good fats, for example), and on the other hand they tell you to stay away from them. It's all messed up. Then you have the issue of actuually knowing better. When you 'know better', like us informed people on this forum, you basically go against every recommendation out there, so people either think your crazy or just an idoit or both.


Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:37 am
by ethelhoney
Generally I am of the opinion that everyone is for his own condition responsible. It is true that it is nowadays very easy to be overweight but the people are not forced to eat so much. I know that it is sometimes very convenient to grab something at McDonald's or some other Fast Food restaurant but nevertheless this should not happen regularly. I am of the opinion that it is important to eat healthy food and to find a good mix between healthy and fast food.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:00 am
by KPj
I don't think fast food has its place at all. It never years ago and we managed ok. If you really can't help yourself I don't think it should take up more than 10% of your diet over the course of a week.

However, I think if you were to single out one thing to be THE problem, I would say it's more 'activity levels'. I would even place it above 'exercise', and diet. People simply don't do anything any more. Parking more than 3 spaces from the door of a supermarket is a real hassle, so much so that it justifies driving around the car park another 8 times until you can get a space closer to the door. God forbid they need to walk.

There are less and less active jobs available all the time, everything is sitting a computer. Doesn't apply to everything but it does to most things. I think it's the sedentary lifestyles that are really killing us. Although I would like to lump 'processed/man made' foods into that as well. Lack of general daily activity and increased consumption (or, RELIANCE) of processed crappy foods I think is the main culprits. Eating a vegatable is as much hassle as walking a quarter a mile to the shop for a newspaper...

I get increasingly disgusted at the goverment and Food Standards Agency and whoever else is responsible for all the stupid information going around. There's so much bad info that people who DO take ownership of their problems end up going down the wrong path anyway. In the UK they just released an over the counter diet pill, too. What does that tell people? Tells them that their problems are just a short term issue which require a short term fix and leads them away from the root of the problem - their LIFESTYLE.


Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:04 am
by robertscott
I'm not particularly anti-fast food. Food is obviously our fuel, and it's important to eat right to stay healthy etc etc, there's no denying that, but i think the enjoyment factor shouldn't be overlooked. I think reducing all food down to nutrient level is fine in terms of staying healthy and keeping a balanced diet, but sometimes you just want to eat something nice, and say what you like about fast food, generally speaking it's pretty delicious. Obviously a diet consisting of lots of fast food is a bad thing and you'll be fat and unhealthy etc, but the occasional MaccyD's isn't going to kill you.

what i'm basically trying to say is i do think fast food has its place: it's fine as an occasional guilty pleasure. It's only when it becomes a large part of your diet that there's a problem.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:49 am
by KPj
The occassional Maccy D's actually almost cripples me. Puts my stomach in knots, cramps etc - very uncomfortable. And I used to have atleast one a week, many moons ago. I also feel sick now just a the thought of Mayo, where as, I used to put in everything.

On the flip side, it's not uncommon for someone that lives on fast food or processed foods to experience a similar thing when they eat veggies (body rejects them, because it's so used to crap).

I don't think anyone will realise how bad fast food really is until they get off it for a long period of time and stick to as natural a diet as they can. You can make very tastey things from just 'meat n veg'. When you go out for your dinner you rarely get transfat, deep fried salt ridden meals served to you. YOu normally get a combination of meat, veg, seasoning, some cheese of some sort and some other starchy carbs. These are all pretty natural healthy foods. Granted, some restaurants do a nice job of screwing up the health properties.

You should buy some cook books and get cooking. 'The more you cook, the better you look'. First one I bought was Gourmet Nutrition, some of the meals in that, which are suitable on a FAT LOSS plan, taste AMAZING. Even if it's "Gordon Ramsays Healthy Eating". Someone bought me that for my birthday, and it's actually not bad in terms of macro break down although I do add a little more meat where possible. The recipes taste amazing though.

When you're constantly eating things like for a long time, even the thought of a Big Mac is quite sickening.

But, you know - each to their own. If you need to have Fast food, have it. I agree that it would have limited (if any) impact if it doesn't make up much of your diet.


p.s if the food doesn't make you sick, don't all the fat people make you sick? Last time I was at a McD's I just felt like a looser. Harsh, I know, but, looking around, I just wanted to turn around and do a full pelt sprint to the gym!

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:47 am
by robertscott
constitution of a brass monkey me KPj! MacD's, Burger King, kebabs, pizzas... nothing makes me feel sick, seefood diet, y'know? Plus the only time i eat a MacD's is when I'm hungover, so I already feel like hell. I love to cook, have a few cook books (although i got bought a copy of a Jamie Oliver cookbook a few years ago and i refuse to so much as look at it, i hate him). Especially when i'm with my girlfriend, i like to know that she's eating ok. The only part of my diet that worries me a bit is the amount of flavoured milk i drink. It has loads of refined sugar, and i mean LOADS. Although I'm a hundred miles away from getting fat i worry about the effect it's having on my insulin sensitivity.

But aye i totally understand what you mean about all the fat folk in there, i console myself by knowing that i may be rough and eating crap today, but tomorrow is a new day and I'll be going to the gym.

I've been lucky though in terms of my genetics, my bodyfat has always been very low, i would maybe have a different view of fast food if that was not the case...

But getting back to the original point, i remember when i was a kid on a day out with my family, we'd get a Macdonald's as a treat when we were out shopping or whatever, so unhealthy food=treat. I'm sure my family were not unique in that respect, so there's this culture of fast food being a kind of reward. Even now when I'm hungover and feeling sorry for myself I'll treat myself to some junk food to cheer me up. A salad just wouldn't cut it...

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:02 am
by TimD
RS, what have you got against Jaimie Oliver? Seems to be a pretty decent cook with loads of good ideas on how to use real food. A few years ago they brought him over here across the pond, and he was working with school districts to clean up their cafeteria fare and make is healthy and fun for the kids.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:06 am
by KPj
Good point on the Treat thing. It's very common. "if you eat all you're vegetables you can fill yourself full of crap and ruin all the goodness!". lol. That's the mentality that's drummed into us all. In Scotland it's worse. Any country that deep fries a Mars Bar should be ashamed. I'm proud to say i've never had a deep fried Mars bar. How do you make a deep fried pizza even worse??? Make into a pizza crunch!! with the transfat loaded batter around it. Sometimes I think Scots thrive for high blood pressure. "wit! that's crap, my mates blood pressure is higher than that, surely i can beat him!"... Down to the chip shop for a Pizza crunch and a Deep fried Mars bar, then into the pub for a pint or 10. Just normal, every day life for a Scot lol.

and, I think Jamie Oliver is easy to hate. Very easy to hate actually! But he's doing some good things, you know. He's probably done more than the goverment has in the last 10 years in terms of trying to educate people. His programs do a good job at revealing just how bad some people in the UK are when it comes to cooking and making food choices. But, yeah, he's just a very hate-able guy, I think. Ramsay all the way.


Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:59 am
by robertscott
It's his face Tim, i can't look at him. I just can't. Although i have to admit he's done a lot of good regarding cleaning up school dinners.

KPj you've never had a deep fried Mars? I wonder if posters across the pond have ever even heard of one. You should get one just to see what it's like (actually surprisingly nice!), although I haven't had one in over a decade. Scotland is known as the "sick man of Europe", it is quite embarrassing, our generation is the first in history predicted to have a shorter lifespan than the generation previous, and that's purely because of our lifestyle.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:06 pm
by hoosegow
I'm moving to Scottland.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 1:29 pm
by TimD
I used to ship out of Glasgow. Hoose, you'd love it there. You can get all kinds of good fried stuff, not to mention various lagers and ales. One day I went into a fish and chips joint, and saw they were advertising fried chicken. Here across the pond, that means a southern thing broken into pieces, breaded and fried. So I ordered one, and the gal pulled out this whole chicken and dumped it into a pot of boiling oil. I'd neer seen that done before, and it was surprizingly good. Have heard of the deep fried candy bars, but never tried one, and you can get them here.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 2:14 pm
by hoosegow
I'm thinking deep fried Twizzlers.

Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 2:15 pm
by hoosegow
OOO, with that powdered sugar sprinkled on it.

Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:01 am
by KPj
robertscott wrote:It's his face Tim, i can't look at him. I just can't. Although i have to admit he's done a lot of good regarding cleaning up school dinners.
haha. I actually kind of 'get' where you're coming from. Ramsay has set the bar for chefs. They need to shout and swear a lot, otherwise, they're just not that enjoyable to watch.
robertscott wrote: KPj you've never had a deep fried Mars? I wonder if posters across the pond have ever even heard of one. You should get one just to see what it's like (actually surprisingly nice!), although I haven't had one in over a decade. Scotland is known as the "sick man of Europe", it is quite embarrassing, our generation is the first in history predicted to have a shorter lifespan than the generation previous, and that's purely because of our lifestyle.
Never had one.... I don't think I could.... I used to love getting a deep fried haggis aka haggis supper. Sometimes i'm still tempted for one. But, 'haggis pakora' sees me through the cravings lol. My local pub/restaurant serves amazing haggis pakora. My diet actually used to be terrible. Although, i've always ate a lot of protein. You know, if there's protein in it, it's not THAT bad! Used to get really annoyed at my dad because all we would get is chicken - all the time. We got so sick of it, but i'm sure that's half the reason I can eat so much meat. Have enjoyed big BLUE steaks since I was in my early teens. I was in Torronto a few years ago and they wouldn't cook my steak blue. I was angry. Anyway, enough about steaks, makes me too hungry.

I remember some program was on about binge drinking, and a pub in Glasgow was the 'creme de la creme' of binge drinkers. There were guys who had been told if they keep going the way they're going, then they won't last more than a couple of years. Big shock, eh? That'll teach 'em! Well, not in Scotland. Even death doesn't scare the drinkers. "i've drank 15pints of Cider all my days and i'll be f*****d if i'm stopping now". Not an exact quote but it was along those lines!


Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:32 am
by jeffrerr
Deep fried Mars Bar is actually nicer than it sounds, had ne last year, theydo them here in little old Tassie but never tried one til I was in Scotland! Shared half a deep fried pizza with the wife, that was a disaster! I serioulsy can't believe what the Scots will dee fry, I think I saw a deep fried car door handle in one place! :roll:

I still blame me for being fat!